ANGUS X HOLSTEIN

[piedmontese]

i have been buying bottle calves from a local dairy and most have been holstein bull calves.i have gotten 5 holstein x angus heifers that i am considering keeping to breed.what does anyone think of this.obviously they will give plenty of milk and i like that and another advantage is how tame they will be.

 

[dun]

There are a copule of possible pitfalls to the dairy beef crosses. They will milk too heavy to be able to maintain condition on pasture and their calves will usually show enough dairy to get them docked by experienced buyers. We started a herd that way many years ago, they would milk themselves poor if the calf would take it, if they didn;t they would get too fat to breed back reliably. And as I said, even in the 70s they got docked as dairy.

 

[Angus Cowman]

yep what Dun said but if you bred them back angus or another beef breed and got some hfrs out of them then you should have some pretty decent cows
I have a neighbor all of his cows are anywhere from 1/4 to 1/8 holstein and and he has some dandy calves and they don't show dairy

 

[piedmontese]

yep what Dun said but if you bred them back angus or another beef breed and got some hfrs out of them then you should have some pretty decent cows
I have a neighbor all of his cows are anywhere from 1/4 to 1/8 holstein and and he has some dandy calves and they don't show dairy

well if i keep them i will breed them to a saler bull the first time and a piedmontese the second.as far as docking that won't affect me when i breed them to a pied as i sell all my 50% pied calves to a buyer and it dont matter what color they are just as long as they are half pied.he pays top market for steers and he also pays steer price for heifers.he takes them from 5 to 6 weights.

 

[bishopcattleco]

I have some cross bred beef hol cows.I also bought some angus hol xheifers last year.I have never been docked.Breed these cattle right so they are calving in march or april.You wont have as many bag problems.After you do wean the calves use dry cow treatment.ive had trouble with dairy cows calving in july august there bags break down.No cure for that.stay on top of when they cycle.But they are some of the best cows i have ever had.

 

[MoGal]

With their first calf, they may get a little thin. Any cow that milks well, has a harder time as a 2 yr old (still growing and has their first calf as well).
Also try to stay away from the hot, humid summer months as calving. Calves are more susceptible to scours and the cow may have bag problems as the newborn calf usually picks out 2 teats to nurse on. To me, for this area, Sept. 15 to Nov. 30 works well and I'm trying to get all of the commercial herd into this window frame.

To some, you are mongrelizing your herd. I could post pics and I seriously doubt that most people could pick out whether they are 1/8, 1/4 or 3/8 holstein or for some of them even 1/2 holstein.
Cross them back to a beef breed and I think you'll be satisfied.

I've tried talking the hubby into getting a charolais bull to cross on these aged cows, but he just refuses to budge..... I can't say it would be a terminal cross because I'd want to keep heifers as I really like a charx cow. But with your piedmontese (aren't they continentals?) it should be nice calves.

 

[Chuckie]

MoGal,
I can definitely relate to your problem!!! :nod:
Chuckie

 

[Stocker Steve]

i have gotten 5 holstein x angus heifers that i am considering keeping to breed.what does anyone think of this.obviously they will give plenty of milk and i like that and another advantage is how tame they will be.

These crosses mature early and are very fertile.
They can raise some whopper calves on good feed, but then usually break down after a couple years.
The ones I have seen vary a lot in type -- most look very dairy, some not very much.
There are lots of good heifers out there. I would only keep a X that had more muscle and more capacity and less leg than most.

One of my two biggest calves is a B&W out of a 900# "RA" heifer. :shock: Obviously she has some Holstein in the wood pile but it only shows in the size and color of her calf. The other big calf is out of a 1000# red shorthorn heifer. They are both outproducing the big old beef cows. Preg check time will tell the tale.

 

[novaman]

I've got a couple Gelb X Holstein girls in the beef herd. They almost always have the biggest calves in the herd. They milk strong and while body condition does dip a bit they are always bred back on time and recover rather nicely in the offseason.

 

[Angus Cowman]

The only reason I suggested an 1/4 to an 1/8 holsteins was it seems like after a 1/2 breed gets to 6 or 7 yrs old their bags start breaking down

The guy I know crosses them with a brangus bull and they raise some real nice calves

 

[Stocker Steve]

The only reason I suggested an 1/4 to an 1/8 holsteins was it seems like after a 1/2 breed gets to 6 or 7 yrs old their bags start breaking down

1/4 continental / dairy is a much better momma cow mix

 

[dun]

The only reason I suggested an 1/4 to an 1/8 holsteins was it seems like after a 1/2 breed gets to 6 or 7 yrs old their bags start breaking down

The guy I know crosses them with a brangus bull and they raise some real nice calves

We didn;t have that problem, they just weren;t the foragers that the more beef crosses were.

 

[upfrombottom]

Have you thought about using them as surrogates? Don't know is it is feasible where you are but you could possibly wind up with some really, really, good replacements using ET.

 

[randiliana]

We have 1 Holstein x Angus cow in the herd. She calved at 16 months, and has moved up 1 month ever since, now she is one of our early calvers. She raises a good enough, but not a great calf every year. She's not huge, and has an absolutely lovely udder. I expect that she will last in the herd for a good number of years. She definitely looks dairy, and her calves so far have had that look too. This year's calf is out of an Angus x Simm bull and I think it is better.

Here is a recent photo of her.

 

[Lucky_P]

They'll make OK cows, but as others have indicated, depending upon your management scheme and level of nutrition, some may be 'hard keepers'; may milk themselves down to nothing and be hard to get re-bred. A big calf is one thing, but if you only get one every two years, you're losing money feeding 'em.
I started my herd with a bunch of Holstein heifers, but nothing still here has more than 1/8 Holstein in their background, and not more than a couple of them - the others have 'culled themselves'.
I'd have some concern about the possibility of introducing Johne's Disease(see recent thread in the Health and Nutrition area), as it's pretty common in dairy herds, and even though these heifers may look good now - or even at 2, 4, 6 years of age, if they're infected, they could serve as a source of infection for their own calves, as well as other animals in the herd.

 

[piedmontese]

They'll make OK cows, but as others have indicated, depending upon your management scheme and level of nutrition, some may be 'hard keepers'; may milk themselves down to nothing and be hard to get re-bred. A big calf is one thing, but if you only get one every two years, you're losing money feeding 'em.
I started my herd with a bunch of Holstein heifers, but nothing still here has more than 1/8 Holstein in their background, and not more than a couple of them - the others have 'culled themselves'.
I'd have some concern about the possibility of introducing Johne's Disease(see recent thread in the Health and Nutrition area), as it's pretty common in dairy herds, and even though these heifers may look good now - or even at 2, 4, 6 years of age, if they're infected, they could serve as a source of infection for their own calves, as well as other animals in the herd.

is johne's passed to the calves at birth?

 

[randiliana]

The way I understand Johne's is that it can be passed to the calf before it is born, and, through the colostrum.

 

[dun]

The way I understand Johne's is that it can be passed to the calf before it is born, and, through the colostrum.

From johnes.org
How do animals get infected?
Johne's disease typically enters a herd or flock of animals when an infected, but healthy-looking, animal is purchased. This infected animal then sheds the organism onto the premises – perhaps onto pasture or into water shared by its new herdmates. Young animals are far more susceptible to infection than are adults: these kids, lambs, or calves swallow the organism along with grass or water. Perhaps they are bottle-fed with MAP-contaminated milk collected from the infected but healthy-appearing new animal. (The milk may become contaminated from the environment (manure-stained teats) or, in the advanced stages of the infection, the bacterium is shed directly into the milk.) Animals may even have been infected before they are born (in utero transmission). Thus the infection spreads, often without the owner's being aware of it.

 

[slamotto]

If you were looking to AI breed a holstein heifer to an Angus bull, what traits would you look for in the bull to help eliminate the dairy look? (Any resulting bull calves would be raised as steers, heifers kept as mothers to be bred to beef breed again.)

CED and BW would be important, since we are dealing with first calf holstein heifers, right?

What other EPDs would you look at? Obviously, the resulting Holstein/Angus are probably going to produce plenty of milk...so would you select a bull with low Milk numbers? Would a bull with negative Yearling height be desirable?

 

[Loch Valley Fold]

I have several holstein & Jersey x angus cows to me the Jersey is the better cross not a large frame animal they tend to be Jersey size but Angus width & black in colour. The main problem with the Holstein x cows that we have is they have too much milk for just 1 calf so these cows are back in my parents dairy herd. Ours could very easily handle 3 calves but as I don't have the time to foster calves onto the cows it is easier to have them milked.

This is a bull we bred & raised his mother is 3/4 Angus 1/4 Jersey his father is fullblood Lowline