Angus x Char. pics

[DOC HARRIS]

Stardust - Very good "breedy" head showing good beef cattle characteristics. DOC HARRIS

Could you elaborate on what a breedy head is? I'm guessing you mean the look of her head leads you to believe she is more fertile/better maternally?

Thanks

Arkieman-The term "Breedy Head" (as with a lot of colloquial expressions) is frequently used in conversational language. It is specific reference to the head and face of individual animals when discussing 'type' or Breed characteristics - not in regard to fertility or maternal traits.

DOC HARRIS

 

[deenranch]

I have been in the cattle business all my life. The best piece of advice I can give is to look for the faults in your cattle. Don't look at how good you think they are. Look at the bad points and see where you need to go from there. As for finding a bull. Use one that has lots of muscle and look at his EPD's. Use a bull with a low bw and a high ww. Look at the milk epd. The milk directly transfers into pounds of muscle. If a cow don't milk, then the calf won't grow. As far as breed to go back with. Stay with the smokies. The feedlots are really pushing smokies right now. The Char X will grow faster in the feedlot than anything. It's a fact. Ask anyone who actually knows what they are talking about. Good luck.

 

[Arkieman]

Stardust - Very good "breedy" head showing good beef cattle characteristics. DOC HARRIS

Could you elaborate on what a breedy head is? I'm guessing you mean the look of her head leads you to believe she is more fertile/better maternally?

Thanks

Arkieman-The term "Breedy Head" (as with a lot of colloquial expressions) is frequently used in conversational language. It is specific reference to the head and face of individual animals when discussing 'type' or Breed characteristics - not in regard to fertility or maternal traits.

DOC HARRIS

O.K., so it's just a subjective type thing...

Guy #1: "Boy I sure like the head on that cow".
Guy #2: "Yeah, but her butt looks like a funnel - you should
sell her"
Guy #1: "Can't - head looks too good"

I guess I'm confused that a guy who tows such a hard line on cattle would be influenced by something as cosmetic as a "purty head"!

Doc I'm just pulling your chain, you've probably forgotten more about cattle than I'll ever know, but I think it shows that we all like a certain "look" sometimes even when it may not have any bearing on what kind of "meat" is put on the plate...

 

[suscofa]

My comment was tongue in cheek.....Doc you must admit you got pretty defensive. I know from your posts that you are very intelligent, but I bet it's not the first time you've been called a hard ass. I look forward to your future posts as I know I have much to learn about cattle.

 

[DOC HARRIS]

My comment was tongue in cheek.....Doc you must admit you got pretty defensive. I know from your posts that you are very intelligent, but I bet it's not the first time you've been called a hard ass. I look forward to your future posts as I know I have much to learn about cattle.

suscofa-I imagine that I have been called more than a "hard ass " in my 81 years! My wife (Ruthie) and one of my Grandaughters calls me "PICKY - PICKY - PICKY!" And I understand it, but I have found in Living and in Cattle and in Raising Kids - half-way doesn't get the job done! That is a big reason that our country is on the edge of going to hell in a hand basket right now - parents of the last two generations have abdicated their responsibilities TO and FOR their children and let half-baked teachers and Left-Wing Socialists subvert our Freedoms and Patriotisms. Americans NEED to get defensive - we have wimped out long enough on EVERYTHING!

As you can tell - - I have pretty strong feelings about MOST things. Maybe it is because I am 81 years old! I have become a "curmudgeon!" (Look it up!)

DOC HARRIS

 

[DOC HARRIS]

Stardust - Very good "breedy" head showing good beef cattle characteristics. DOC HARRIS

Could you elaborate on what a breedy head is? I'm guessing you mean the look of her head leads you to believe she is more fertile/better maternally?

Thanks

Arkieman-The term "Breedy Head" (as with a lot of colloquial expressions) is frequently used in conversational language. It is specific reference to the head and face of individual animals when discussing 'type' or Breed characteristics - not in regard to fertility or maternal traits.

DOC HARRIS

O.K., so it's just a subjective type thing...

Guy #1: "Boy I sure like the head on that cow".
Guy #2: "Yeah, but her butt looks like a funnel - you should
sell her"
Guy #1: "Can't - head looks too good"

I guess I'm confused that a guy who tows such a hard line on cattle would be influenced by something as cosmetic as a "purty head"!

Doc I'm just pulling your chain, you've probably forgotten more about cattle than I'll ever know, but I think it shows that we all like a certain "look" sometimes even when it may not have any bearing on what kind of "meat" is put on the plate...

Arkieman-Guy #1: "Boy I sure like the head on that cow".
Guy #2: "Yeah, but her butt looks like a funnel - you should
sell her"
Guy #1: "Can't - head looks too good"

I guess I'm confused that a guy who tows such a hard line on cattle would be influenced by something as cosmetic as a "purty head"!

:lol2: :lol2: :banana: hahahaha I've go to admit - THAT is a funny bit, and pretty darned subtle, too!

But now that you have mentioned it (and I had decided that I wouldn't go into an extensive amount of detail) I will elaborate on the seemingly insignificant and perhaps trifling so-called "cosmetic" aspect of a "Breedy" head.

Every breed of livestock, from Beef Cows to Sheep, Goats, Horses, and even Alpaca's, have Breed characteristics for that particular species, and breeds within those species, which are attractive and pleasant to observe - for one reason or for more than just one reason. In beef cattle, if you will scrutinize carefully some of the physical features of a beef animal's head - ears, poll, dish between the eyes, muzzle, EYES (round, large, almond-shaped, etc.), width of mouth, expression (some look pretty darned stupid - and ARE), yes, even to the location of the hair whorl(s) on the face, you will see animals which will endear you to them and some that you will want to chuck down the disposal! Now, why is that? PERSONAL PREFERENCE and also because of past experiences with similar-looking animals during your lifetime! Why,- - it's just like women! There are some who have the most - - - uh - - I mean- a - well, give it some thought!

Back to the hair whorls. There are those breeders who will NOT keep a replacement heifer if the hair whorl is ABOVE the imaginery line drawn between the eyes! Or if they have (God forbid) TWO hair whorls!! Why is that? Temperment! High hair whorls indicate that the individual is ready to emulate "The Cow That Jumped Over The Moon!" And what makes breeder's think that the hair whorls have anything to do with lack of docility? PAST EXPERIENCES!

I had an Angus heifer 60 some-odd years ago who was BEAUTIFUL, had a beautiful head with a nice dish to the face, and had terrific calves, easily, was very docile, and she was from the Missouri Barbara Angus Family! I loved that little girl! No Roman nose for me! Missouri Barbara. If I had a herd right now, I would carefully seek out a Missouri Barbara Heifer. The line was developed by the University of Missouri Beef Department, and their herdsman who was from Scotland. She had a BEEFY head, and it indicated, to me, that a cow that LOOKED like that and had a face like that would be docile, have great calves easily, hair whorls in the right place, and I could throw my arms around her neck and say, "You are my pretty baby! You have a 'purty' head!" and she would MAKE ME MONEY! Maybe she wouldn't - but I would THINK that she would - so I would learn toward that type in my selection protocols. . . . and probably have a bearing on the kind of meat put on the table, too!

All of the above to explain - "Breedy Head"!

DON'T GET ME STARTED!

DOC HARRIS

 

[Beefy]

you rang?

 

[DOC HARRIS]

you rang?

-Beefy-

Sorry! I guess I was thinking about that little Missouri Barbara Heifer!

DOC HARRIS

 

[Arkieman]

Doc - That's good stuff!! Thanks for sharing.

p.s. I started to put "purty mouth" - remember from the movie Deliverence? "He shore has a purty mouf, don't he?"

 

[aussie_cowgirl]

ALL are merely average potential BEEF producers!

Bullet - Good topline, level rump but needs heavier bone and shows weak hindquarters.

Fiona - This heifer is a more beef type heifer than Bullet, but appears cowhocked and needs more bone. She has a good head, and should make a fairly good brood cow if she is bred to a really good BEEF BULL! Better hindquarters than the Bullet cow.

Stardust - Very good "breedy" head showing good beef cattle characteristics. Well defined foreleg. Needs to be deeper through the heart girth, and poor 'Funnel Butt' hindquarters.

Luna - Her head is too large in proportion to her body, although the camera angle may have something to do with that problem, however she needs more bone, has a sloping rump, weak hindquarters, is pinched in the heart girth.

You didn't ask for comments on the sire of these heifers, but I feel compelled to do so anyway! G A Rito F54 is SO weak in the hindquarters and demonstrates an exaggerated FUNNEL BUTT! This is the prime reason for your heifers ALL showing this weak hindquarters trait! Look at him critically and don't be BARN BLIND!

Fireball - Very lacking in the hindquarters and shallow flanked. Cross-breeding with this bull will not benefit you genotypically or genetically.

Cocoa - This is a very bad picture and poor positioning of the bull to be able to analyse his characteristics adequately. His hindquarters are insufficient and inadequate. Funnel Butt!

Diesel is your best BEEF BULL, but needs more spring of rib and a deeper flank. How will he balance the Phenotype and Genotype of your cows?

In order to successfully and CONSISTENTLY breed profit-making Beef Cattle, one must incorporate the very best BULL genetics that is possible, year after year after year! You can lose 15 - 20 years of careful grading-up of your herd by using one generation of an unsatisfactory bull!

I know that you didn't request this critique, but I felt obligated to offer my opinion anyway. Breeding Beef Cattle is a tough business, and you can throw away years of effort and MONEY in an unguarded moment.

DOC HARRIS

Haha. i havent been on in a long time, i have missed you and your comments doc.