Aggressive young bull

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akraemer

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Hi,

I work at a treatment center that is set on a farm, and we have a holstein bull that is about a year old. Recently he has become very playful, and wants to push everyone who goes into the pasture around with his head. Sometimes he seems a little rough, and I currently have a large bruise from him trying to play.

I'm wondering if there is a way to behave around him that will decrease this behavior? Often the clients will push back at his head, which seems to encourage him, but it's also the natural thing to do.

Also, would castrating him help with this? Will he grow out of it? Do I need to be very concerned that he will accidentally hurt someone, or that he might lose his temper and hurt someone?

I'm just looking for any sort of advice on how to make sure everyone stays safe. Thanks for any suggestions.
 
Catrating him might help, but I sort of doubt it at this point. He should have been castrated before he started acting like a bull.

In all serious here, He shouldnt be in close contact with your patients. He could seriously hurt someone, and I mean bad, and when he decides he is going to do it there will be nothing you can do to stop him. Hes not growing out of it, hes growing in to it. Thats what bulls do.. Your in his pasture and he is making sure you know who the boss is.

If you want a cow for the patients to play with go get another bottle baby and start over. This one has outlived its usefulness to you and has become a liability.
 
Pushing on a bull's head only encourages them to do what comes naturally: "Push other cattle away as a dominance behavior".

A sharp rap on the nose with a fiberglass sorting stick often works to keep a bull out of your space. Otherwise, they should have learned some manners as a calf... Finally...never turn your back on a bull.. ;-)
 
akraemer":2ikr9c2i said:
Hi,

I work at a treatment center that is set on a farm, and we have a holstein bull that is about a year old. Recently he has become very playful, and wants to push everyone who goes into the pasture around with his head. Sometimes he seems a little rough, and I currently have a large bruise from him trying to play.

I'm wondering if there is a way to behave around him that will decrease this behavior? Often the clients will push back at his head, which seems to encourage him, but it's also the natural thing to do.

Also, would castrating him help with this? Will he grow out of it? Do I need to be very concerned that he will accidentally hurt someone, or that he might lose his temper and hurt someone?

I'm just looking for any sort of advice on how to make sure everyone stays safe. Thanks for any suggestions.
two problems with him he's a bull first and a holstein. best not to have any contact with him period. because he may hurt somebody but it wont be a accident
 
Get rid of the bull!
Burger or sale barn, but get rid of him.

dun
 
akraemer":7akvghvz said:
Hi,

I work at a treatment center that is set on a farm, and we have a holstein bull that is about a year old. strike one. Recently he has become very playful, and wants to push everyone who goes into the pasture around with his head. strike 2
Sometimes he seems a little rough, and I currently have a large bruise from him trying to play. answering your own question already.

I'm wondering if there is a way to behave around him that will decrease this behavior? not really. beating him might help but probably wont.
Often the clients will push back at his head, which seems to encourage him, but it's also the natural thing to do. stupid. thats challenging him.

Also, would castrating him help with this? doubtful
Will he grow out of it? will only get worse
Do I need to be very concerned that he will accidentally hurt someone, or that he might lose his temper and hurt someone?absolutely!

I'm just looking for any sort of advice on how to make sure everyone stays safe. Thanks for any suggestions. Selling him is the only option i see
 
GET RID OF THIS BULL TODAY.
I raise breding bulls and some wnat to be frendly. I keep an 18 inch garden hose in my truck to train them with. If at an early age they want to get too close I hit them on the nose with the hose so that they know i am in charge. I don't want a bull too close to me.
 
Bulls can be extremely dangerous. Especially Holstien bulls. Usually the have been bottle raised and look at humans as herd mates and will try and assert dominance as they grow into an adult. By nature bulls are aggressive and usually Holstien bulls are VERY aggressive. One moment you are scratching his ears and he is enjoying it and the next a shot of testosterone goes through him and he is butting and stomping all over you. Holstien bulls can get very big. Two thousand pounds is common and they are as agile and quick as a cat. You cannot get away from them if they snap. They can and will kill you very easily. Sell this bull before you or someone else gets hurt or killed. A bull is a bad pet. Buy a bottle feeder heifer or steer and you will be much better off and even those can be a danger at times.
 
Start over with a steer.. I knew a steer at a research place had the nickname Kitchen.. Big old Holstein but he was neutered very young and was as gentle as a dead hog because he didn't have the hormones raging through him.. Pet Dairy Bull around folks who are not used to cattle at all... I can hardly imagine a worse situation to be honest.
 
I am a survivor of a bull attack - he got me down and got me good - here is the story. I could give you lots of detail, but I kept it short because I added some of my previous scribing on bulls - but this nearly killed me.

I wrote this some time ago:

_________________________________________________

The real reason I like to see 'em marked is to prevent some poor hobbyist with 5 cows from getting squished. Bigger operations usually have the experience to cull these out.

Lots of folks buy bulls - not many like aggression. Even those with the big herds know there is no percentage in breeding it
into the herd.

Appears sjackson may not be posting - hope he is reading this - have not told this tale in many years - I was just 18 at the time. Pop heard my story when he got home and did not bat an eye at what I did. Mind you he found me on the floor looking pretty tough. Still had my boots and coat on - fire in the stove - shivering cold.

Watching a bull on the fight is impressive. As long as you are in a spot with an out. When you are in with him - well, it's not much fun.

Bull tried to take me. I lived to tell the tale - about 32 years ago now - mid winter - no one home but me - bull lived for almost 5 minutes - the time it took to limp to the house and pull out the rifle. Went back in the house and curled up on the kitchen floor in front of the wood stove - slept right there for a couple of hours. Total exhaustion.

Tractor about 20 yards away was my saviour - seemed like miles at the time - managed to crawl under it - even while he was pushing me into the ground. You have no idea how heavy he felt on me - still think about it the odd time.

I bet I was right - you will not take my original advice. You might have a problem and you might not - only time will tell - but personally, I am through gambling.

Stay well.

Bez
-------------------------------------------------------

Some time after writing this story - this topic hit the boards again and I wrote this one:
____________________________________________

This statement says it all.

For your info, less than 5% of those who experience a no schitzen attack by a bull live to tell about it. This from an old Cattleman's mag I picked up.

So - you have received some good info from others - but I will add to it.

Go get your rifle and your truck and a few helpers.

Shoot that S.O.B. in the pasture - I would do it now - not tomorrow and not the day after.

Butcher him on the spot. Share the meat with your buddies and get a new bull.

Having had the opportunity to go to two funerals in my life time caused by large animals I want you to know that not only are you taking a chance with this guy, but you are breeding his temperment into his offspring.

You will probably not take this advice, but I give it because I DO KNOW WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT.

Finally, you can ship this bull. Don't you dare do this unless he carries a frigging big red X on his sides. Do not provide some other poor unsuspecting person with you problems and no notification.

Rounding this guy up might be a bit of fun - therefore my shoot and eat suggetion.

So in the end, do nothing and walk the pasture with your family in fear - or solve the problem. Choice is yours.

Bez
----------------------------------------------------

Then there is this one - my very first post back in 2004:

________________________________________________

Well, I have been a lurker for a while. But this topic inspired me to write my first post.

I have worked dairy and beef - small farms and pretty good sized ranches. I can throw a rope - albeit not as good as most - and I can usually tell when I get in over my head. Only problem is - sometimes I am not smart enough to git out while the gittins good!

TxCoUnTrYbOy - in response to your post - our local ag paper recently stated that every year in our part of the country at least two adult farm personnel are killed by a bull attack.

Recent personal experience with bulls:

Last summer - a neighbour approximately 12 miles from here was killed by a de-horned Holstein bull.

I was literally treed in a local pasture last September by a Limo bull that came from about 250 yards away - on the run. And yes, I know what the "look is". You can never forget it once you have seen it. Thank heavens for reasonable sized cedar trees - hard to climb under normal circumstances - but after circling the tree a couple of times with this guy hard after me I managed to get up with VERY LITTLE difficulty. He wanted me bad. Bull is dead.

Two years ago on a ranch in north west Alberta I watched a real nice Angus bull attempt a number on the owners wife. She had been in that small field hundereds of times with no trouble - she escaped this time by the literal skin of her teeth. Ducked under the tractor because she would not have had time to open the door and get in. He actually shook that MX 135 real hard. Bull is dead.

My immediate neighbour - Michelle - sold their bull for burger a couple of days ago - with a big red X on both sides. At the age of 4 1/2 years it was getting to the point no one could check the cows in the pasture unless they were in the truck. You should see the dent in the passenger door. This guy was a Simmental / Char cross. Bull is dead.

We raise Horned Herefords. We leave the ivory on the girls and train the horns down - but only if they stay on the farm. All the animals that leave are de-horned. Yup, we recognize the potentials - but we handle these gals in a decent chute set up and utilize a Hi Hog squeeze.

The bulls we keep on the property are quiet. We take the horns off of them. I do not trust any of them further than I can throw my truck. I firmly believe that given any moment one could take me or a family member. I am not truly afraid of them, but I am darned careful around them - and I always have an escape route in mind. If one looks at me funny he goes for meat with a red X on both sides.

Last year we had a bull from a recognized breeder on our place. He was so friendly it scared the bejeezuz out of me - every time we went into the pasture he would come over for his grain. The owners had hand fed him every day of his life. I immediately instituted a keep out of the field policy unless in a truck or tractor. He was removed the following week - and was I glad to see him go. Found another black bull to finish the job.

Bottom line - my own opinion - there is no safe bull and there is no breed that can truly completely guarantee a safe bull.

That being said, we use bulls - as do thousands of other farmers and ranchers. A.I. is a wonderful tool and we utilize it on a regular basis, but it cannot do the job when your cattle are running on 25,000 acres of grass. And A.I. does not do the job if you are a small operator that does not have a proper restraint capability.

So Frankie - I use Angus bulls to cover the A.I. portion of our red / white herd - that way we always know what "took" and what didn't. You'll always have a market for a good bull. Heck, if they ever open the border I might come your way for a look see.

Final notes: If you ship a bad bull - ship him for meat - mark him with a red X - both sides - and TELL THE AUCTIONEER - do not unload him onto another unsuspecting buyer. Be darned sure you are careful around his progeny - sometimes that attitude carries over.

Long post - but just my thoughts and experiences.

Best to all.
-----------------------------------------------------

Now for my finish:

I love it when folks talk about a playful bull.

No such thing - and you may be a very experienced person, but this comment alone tells me you do not know much about bulls. Not a slur or a hit - just my opinion.

Holsteins are the very worst and they have a well deserved reputation of being capable of going on the prod in a heartbeat - even - no - ESPECIALLY - those that have never been a problem.

I would de-nut this thing without a second thought. I would feed it out and kill it.

I certainly WOULD NOT BREED IT TO ANOTHER ANIMAL.

Along with genetics, temperment can be passed to off spring.

You will do what you will do - all I ask is that you remember the above stories and realize this old guy is still alive because he was lucky when he was stupid.

All you have to do is survive one no schitzen attack or pick up a friend who was unlucky enough to not make it - it will change your life forever.

I will work bulls on horse in a pasture but not on foot. Working bulls in a pen - which is what I suspect you are doing is not very safe - it can be done - but care is required.

I bet this guy is big enough to take you down now.

Do you feel lucky?

Bez>
 
So here I am reading Bez's story again, scrolling, remembering what I read before, the story is the same, no new twists or new characters - but if I ever get to a point where I forget or trivialize the message Bez and other posters are sending - my bulls deserve to eat my lunch.

That animal WILL eventually hurt someone. Or worse.

Ypsilanti! Spent some quality time there at EMU hopping and popping with some SEAL types a few years ago. :D
 
well said..albieit alittle long winded whew

i myself have been attacked by my own hand fed halter broke bull. after 4 yrs he was an 1800 lb brahma. i was lucky. i can still walk..but i limp pretty good an wear a knee brace most of the time now...

you wont find any shortage of stories about bull attacks...i could tell you of at least 2 more myself although not me...

i learned the hard way....

heres to hopin you dont before you or worse one of your patients in your care dont walk so well anymore. limpin from 36 yrs old for the rest of your life is kindof a drag......
 
Holstein bulls are extremely moody and dangerous...and when they get it in their heads to do something, they will do it, you can't stop one short of a bullet in the brain...and they will get more ornery and mean.

My grandfather was never the same after a holstein bull attacked him. The bull came out of nowhere...it was like he was in hiding and stalking my grandfather. He thought the bull was in the back pasture, over the hill, 100 acres away, behind a fence.

You cannot ever let one out of your sight, especially since he is showing agressiveness.

Get him gone, now, today!

Alice
 
Did a copy and paste after a search on this website of another thread:

Beware of the bottle raised male orphan!
By
Joseph M. Stookey
Professor of Animal Behaviour
Western College of Veterinary Medicine
Most people have an appreciation and understanding that mature male animals (bulls,
rams, stags, etc.) are potentially dangerous, but most people fail to appreciate that the
most dangerous males are those that have been bottle raised. Such males become
dangerous because of the fact that they have imprinted onto people; it has neither to do
with how they were treated nor is it due to their genetics. Bottle raised males are simply
"programmed" due to their hand rearing to one day threaten their human rivals.
How is it possible for a tame pet to turn on its caretaker or other humans? First off, all
avian and mammalian neonates are born with a preprogrammed drive to imprint onto
their mother. Imprinting refers to a critical period of time early in the animal's life when
it forms attachments and develops a concept of its own species' identity. Imprinting
provides animals with information about who they are and for males it determines
specifically who they will find attractive when they reach sexual maturity. Only a few
species like cow birds and cuckoos, that are essentially parasites in another bird's nest,
can be reared by surrogate parents and get things "right" when they reach sexual
maturity. The famous German ethologist, Konrad Lorenz demonstrated the imprinting
process in goslings and ducklings and showed that in the absence of their real mothers
these precocial birds would imprint onto their human care taker.
Imprinting has long lasting and important biological and psychological effects on adult
sexual behaviour, which is often irreversible. Males that have been imprinted onto
another species tend to court the surrogate species that raised them. For example, ram
lambs that are raised on nanny goats will court and try to breed female goats when they
reach sexual maturity and they show very little interest in ewes. The same pattern
unfolds in birds. Some farm families have the embarrassing pet tom turkey who spends
his entire life courting and pestering the family members that raised him. That is why in
captive breeding programs for endangered species like the whooping crane or the
California condor the hatchlings are raised and fed by bird puppets. The human
caretakers must stay hidden from the young birds in order to ensure they are properly
imprinted onto the correct species and not imprinted onto humans. Fortunately young
females that imprint onto the wrong species are usually not affected and will remain
attracted to the courtship displays from males of their own species. That is why ewe
lambs that are raised on nanny goats will breed to rams even though their surrogate
mother was a goat.
The point to remember is that orphan males of most species will imprint onto their
surrogate mothers and then later in life will direct their sexual behaviour towards the
surrogate species. If humans become the surrogate species it creates a potentially
dangerous situation. When the male reaches sexual maturity, in addition to his
misdirected attraction, he will have bouts of male aggression that he will direct against
his human "competition". Male aggression is a normal part of sexual behaviour. In
nearly all our livestock and wild species (horses, dogs and cats may be the exception)
bottle raised intact males will show aggression towards humans when they reach sexual
maturity.
Most people mistakenly believe that dairy bulls are dangerous because of their genetics.
It is true that most dairy bulls are dangerous, but it has more to do with their rearing
conditions then their genetics. Most dairy bulls are hand reared in isolation which
contributes to their behaviour towards humans when they become adults. Dr. Ed Price, a
behaviour researcher from the University of California at Davis, has shown that Hereford
bull calves raised in isolation and hand fed by humans became dangerous to people when
they reached adulthood, whereas their group raised counterparts where not mean towards
people.
There are numerous examples of intact male animals that were wonderful pets as young
animals, but grew up to become killers or potential killers of their human caretakers.
When I was a child one of my neighbors was forced to shoot and kill their pet whitetail
buck they had bottle raised, after it had attacked them during rut. This story is not
uncommon. There were 15 deer related human fatalities over a 5 year period in the
United States (Langley and Hunter, 2001); many of these were likely the result of bottle
raised males. During the same time period another 142 humans were killed by cattle.
Though the statistics did not state the exact circumstances, some of these fatalities were
certain to have been caused by hand reared bulls. The "berserk male syndrome", talked
about in llama circles, whereby a male llama suddenly becomes aggressive towards
people is not a syndrome per se, but the result of bottle raising the male llama. Even
bottle raised ram lambs that seem so friendly and docile while growing up have been
known to inflict severe injury onto their caretakers or an unsuspecting visitor (who turns
their back towards them) when the ram becomes mature.
What should you do with orphan newborns? The best option is to look for other lactating
females in the herd or flock who may have lost their own offspring or who have
additional milk. Such females can be excellent candidates provided that they can be
tricked into accepting the orphan as their own. How to get a surrogate mother to accept
the newborn as her own is a story in itself. However, assuming the adoption or cross
fostering is successful, this offers the best possible method for rearing the orphan since a
surrogate mother will likely have the right milk composition, plus she is willing to remain
"on call" for 24 hours a day.
The take home message is that newborn male orphans of deer, elk, bison, cattle, sheep,
goats and llamas should never be bottle raised or at the very least should be castrated
before reaching sexual maturity in order to avoid a dangerous and potentially lethal future
situation. Please spread the word.
References,
Langley, R. L. and J. L. Hunter. 2001. Occupational fatalities due to animal-related events. Wilderness
and Environ. Med. 12:168-174.
Price, E.O. and S. J. R. Wallach. 1990. Physical isolation of hand-reared Hereford bulls increases their
aggressiveness toward humans. Appl-Anim-Behav-Sci. 27:263-267.
 
I always enjoy reading about this subject, its just intriguing for some reason, especially about Holstein bulls. I have only had a run in with a Holstein bull once. I was looking at buying some bred Holstein heifers once and there was a young bull in the pen with them that gave me a look and I was quickly over the fence. This bull was real young maybe a yearling, but he definitely had the "look". I remember one time at the Hamilton, Tx auction when they brought in six of the biggest dang Holstein bulls you ever laid eyes on. Every one bellowed and banged on everything when they ran them through. I think the smallest one weighed over 2100 if I remember right.
 
Bez>":n5ogd3c5 said:
this old guy is still alive because he was lucky when he was stupid.



Bez>

Me, too. I've told the story before, so I'll just summarize it: Young. Stupid. Holstein bull. Broken ribs. Lucky someone else was there.

Please get rid of the bull.
 
john250":l87zoy8q said:
What all the others said.
You ain't gonna win a fight with someone who outweighs you by half a ton.

Or repeatedly slams full force into the back bumper of a 1967 Chevy pickup while it is running 20 miles an hour...w/o once stopping to shake it's head. :shock:

Alice
 
Alice":206lhokx said:
john250":206lhokx said:
What all the others said.
You ain't gonna win a fight with someone who outweighs you by half a ton.

Or repeatedly slams full force into the back bumper of a 1967 Chevy pickup while it is running 20 miles an hour...w/o once stopping to shake it's head. :shock:

Alice

Or tosses 1500 lb bales around like soccer balls.
 

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