A thought for a few thinkers

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Anonymous

welp you just proved my point, ... most of those stupid comments do come from you blackpower.... grow up
 

A. delaGarza

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As for my understanding double muscled cattled don't marbled, the tenderness of the meat is cause by the way their meat tissues are form, or but I'm sure that they don't marble at least Belgian Blue doesn't and you have to feed them at least 2 years to really have some gain of them that is when the double muscle really begans to developed


Mark":208r43yi said:
John,

The whole point of the post is that research is finding out that double muscled cattle marble as well as normal cattle, they just di not put on the intermuscular fat. Since well marbled beef with a minimium of waste fat is the stated goal of the quality programs in the beef industry this is the most probable way to acomplish this goal. Also fat does not cost 5 cents a pound to put on. In fact due to the energy in fat and lower water content fat is 7 times more expensive per pound of gain. This makes a lean steer/heifer with a high quality carcass the economic victor. Ad for them not being black no one at the consumimg end cares. They do care about buying too much fat due to health and economic reasons (waste). Soon the cow calf man is going to be paid on his ability to produce the maximium pounds of high quality beef on the rail from a given number of cows at the lowest cost. This will require a cross bred dam and a heavily muscled terminal sire with double muscled characteristics if this research is correct. This means this optimal steer will be at most a quarter angus. To suppose otherwise is to live in denial of the facts. Something else to keep in mind: The vast majority of purebred operations, even the big ones are small businesses relative to others in other parts of the economy. For example a Starbucks in a humble location will do more volume (10 million) and make more profits than the biggest angus breeders. Just think how much bigger a 50,000 feed lot is compared to any purebred breeder in any breed in dollar terms. In short if a different system can produce beef cheaper we must ask ourselves honestly: "How can I use this information to stay relevant and make a better living?"

Mark

> Are there BLACK Piedmontese or
> Parthenaise? If not they will
> never make it on this board and
> probably not in the standard part
> of the business. Remember that
> "thinkers" are hard to
> come by. This is a "follow
> the herd" industry. Having
> groveled to my Angus friends, I
> will say that beef is muscle,
> muscle is beef, not fat. The
> supermarkets made millions for
> years selling extra fat, many
> don't wish to see that end.
> Economically, if you can sell 5
> cents a pound fat for $1.85 you
> may have a cash generating
> machine, why would you want to
> change it? I am not sure you can
> make as much turning water into
> gold as you can turning fat into
> bucks.

> Opps, sorry Dun, not being as
> politically correct as I should be
> but remember fat is marbling,
> marbling is fat, just calling a
> spade a spade, not sure that is
> either whining or negative. Please
> correct me if I am wrong.



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Anonymous

Angus Black Angus are what the consumer wants, or so it would appear. After all ,they ask for it by name, when is the last time anyone heard some say in the market (How about giving me so of them Longhorn stakes) ever? never I say. I usually like to have a open mind, But I do get tired of small minded slanders about Black Angus cattle, if they were not good cattle the cattle bussiness would not be turning black. I am always open to improving my herd, that why I have Hereford Bull in the field with my Black Angus cows, I like them F-1 Black Baldies. But you can bet that them F-1 will have a Black Angus bull on them, I am not getting to far away from the Black Angus gene pool. If every one in the country used a Black Angus bull the next two years , on there herd, they would see more profits and a higher quality herd..We would have to excluded the Reg. herds , and the other pets, and non beef producers, but as a whole the above statement is very true. I do think the deep south herds could use a litte angus in them, prehaps Brangus , that is Black Angus also. I have no doubts that other breeds or composites of different breeds wi come into the limelight just as the Hereford did and the Black Angus did, But I serious do not think that any thing can have the impact that these breed did . Oh there are people who are going to point out the Bramahs( A composite) have did a lot for the hot areas, and that is the truth they have..Alf
 
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Thank you for posting this Mark. We raise and sell locker beef locally and our customers are much happier with the Parthenais and Belgium Blue Angus crosses than the straight Angus. Another thing to add is that the Double Muscled gene causes the meat to have finer muscle tissues making it much more tender. It is very hard to find these breeds in the US and I am hoping to find more purebred Parthenais in the US.
 

Nesikep

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Christina VanL":wxc973xu said:
Thank you for posting this Mark. We raise and sell locker beef locally and our customers are much happier with the Parthenais and Belgium Blue Angus crosses than the straight Angus. Another thing to add is that the Double Muscled gene causes the meat to have finer muscle tissues making it much more tender. It is very hard to find these breeds in the US and I am hoping to find more purebred Parthenais in the US.
You do realize this is a 15 year old thread..
 

TennesseeTuxedo

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Nesikep":3ve177qa said:
Christina VanL":3ve177qa said:
Thank you for posting this Mark. We raise and sell locker beef locally and our customers are much happier with the Parthenais and Belgium Blue Angus crosses than the straight Angus. Another thing to add is that the Double Muscled gene causes the meat to have finer muscle tissues making it much more tender. It is very hard to find these breeds in the US and I am hoping to find more purebred Parthenais in the US.
You do realize this is a 15 year old thread..

Yes it is Nesi but isn't it funny how the debate never changes?
 

WalnutCrest

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Christina VanL":1kiwqbzj said:
<snip>Another thing to add is that the Double Muscled gene causes the meat to have finer muscle tissues making it much more tender.<snip>

Not every myoatatin mutation expresses itself the same way. Nor every myoatatin mutation is "double muscling".

The conventional problem with "double muscling" is that some myoatatin mutations begin expressing themselves in utero and can cause great difficulty in calving. The nystatin mutations that express themselves in utero are the traditional "double muscling" mutations.

There are other mutations that don't express until the calves are on the ground. These don't fit the traditional complaint as there is no change to the calving ease of the calf or its dam.

Finally, some myoatatin mutations result in more long thin muscle fibers (which results in tender beef) and others result in the same number of muscle fibers, but their diameter is increased (tougher eating).
 

Son of Butch

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TennesseeTuxedo":w0s2enqy said:
Nesikep":w0s2enqy said:
Christina VanL":w0s2enqy said:
Thank you for posting this Mark. We raise and sell locker beef locally and our customers are much happier with the Parthenais and Belgium Blue Angus crosses than the straight Angus. Another thing to add is that the Double Muscled gene causes the meat to have finer muscle tissues making it much more tender. It is very hard to find these breeds in the US and I am hoping to find more purebred Parthenais in the US.
You do realize this is a 15 year old thread..

Yes it is Nesi but isn't it funny how the debate never changes?
It took 40 years for Turkey to become the gold standard for Thanksgiving dinners.
To think any niche market can make inroads faster is naive.
 

slick4591

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Son of Butch":3bxsi7pt said:
snip...
To think any niche market can make inroads faster is naive.

Call me a bit crazy, but I hope these animals stay in the niche category because of the money involved. I get better prices on my calves than any of you commercial guys. Just sold a 3/4 pied 500 lb steer at 5 months for $900, and the guy didn't care that he had not been weaned. That's at least couple of hundred more than he would have brought commercially. And I'm not even going to talk about about the seed stock game. No, keep the niche market lean as I like it that way
 

Nesikep

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Niche markets are very quickly oversaturated.. Ostriches are a great example, fallow deer, alpacas and llamas, pot bellied pigs, just to name a few..
 

WalnutCrest

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Nesikep":2oczqnwh said:
Niche markets are very quickly oversaturated.. Ostriches are a great example, fallow deer, alpacas and llamas, pot bellied pigs, just to name a few..

You're equating "beef cattle with the wrong coloring" with ostrich, fallow deer, alpaca, llama or pot bellied pig?
 

Nesikep

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I'm talking about any niche market.. Cattle with the 'wrong' coloring all taste like beef still, they're still cows, and if you do the butchering yourself, no one will know it was the 'wrong' color
 

Muddy

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WalnutCrest":2bz6frrs said:
Nesikep":2bz6frrs said:
Niche markets are very quickly oversaturated.. Ostriches are a great example, fallow deer, alpacas and llamas, pot bellied pigs, just to name a few..

You're equating "beef cattle with the wrong coloring" with ostrich, fallow deer, alpaca, llama or pot bellied pig?
I can think of several cattle breeds fits in this category. Sure you might thinks that your niche cattle market is stable but just wait till the demand for the niche breed gets less and all you have is worthless surplus cattle.

I just sold a nice 6 months old commercial black bull calf for $900 last fall.
 

Nesikep

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I think if you exclude exotic colors, and look at other 'niche' traits, like mini cows, then that holds more true.. there is less value as beef in them, and more as a pet market.. I think they're largely overvalued, it's just that I guess the demand hasn't plummeted, or supply hasn't outgrown it (yet)
 

Muddy

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Nesikep":1areqjqp said:
I think if you exclude exotic colors, and look at other 'niche' traits, like mini cows, then that holds more true.. there is less value as beef in them, and more as a pet market.. I think they're largely overvalued, it's just that I guess the demand hasn't plummeted, or supply hasn't outgrown it (yet)
Lowlines, Dexters and mini Herefords used to be expensive but now they're getting cheaper in some local areas. Highlands, galloways and shorthorns are dirty common......and cheaper. Slick and probably the Aubrac breeder has an advantage over the other niche breeds is that they have limited numbers of saleable animals available. Many niche cattle breeders made this mistake by expanding the cattle numbers in hopes they will earned more money by selling more animals.
 

Jeanne - Simme Valley

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When you are referring to "color", are you talking about red vs black? If so, I don't see any advantage to one or the other in my herd. Excluding the "purebred" aspect of my herd, my STEERS sell to a feedlot direct. He pays exactly the same price whether they are black or red, or have some white on them. If they are good cattle & they make the buyer money, he does not care what color they are.
 

Muddy

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Jeanne - Simme Valley":2uyhyfaz said:
When you are referring to "color", are you talking about red vs black? If so, I don't see any advantage to one or the other in my herd. Excluding the "purebred" aspect of my herd, my STEERS sell to a feedlot direct. He pays exactly the same price whether they are black or red, or have some white on them. If they are good cattle & they make the buyer money, he does not care what color they are.
No he's not talking about the reds, he's talking about the odd colors.
 
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