91 pound BW for New Calves!

[BucknerLimFlex]

Hi y'all! Our farm has had some serious problems. Let me lay out the details: Last year we bought a registered Angus Bull to be bred to our 2 year old Limousine Heifers. Heifer's are absolutely gorgeous and have a wonderful disposition. We started calving this week. So far out of 4 heifers to have calved, we have lost 3 calfs. ): All three of the calfs have been bulls, weighed 90-91 pounds, and each have had to be pulled. When pulled, all the calf's were dead. This morning we pulled calf No. 4 and she was a heifer. Cow and calf are doing well, so far. The heifer calf weighed 87 pounds.
This is the young Angus bull's first time being bred. Any thoughts on why we are having consecutively high birth weights? We have been raising Lim-Flex for awhile now, this is just hurtful to be loosing all these calfs.

 

[Taurus]

Either one of these answers I have. Pick one.
1.) These calves must not built right for a smooth birth.
2.) Heifers must have small pelvic enough to have some trouble for giving birth. (Did you just said that heifers are two years old already when you brought a bull in?)
3.) Too much high nutrient diet during the last trimester months which can lead to increasing the birthweights.

 

[branguscowgirl]

What do the EPDs look like on your bull for BW?

 

[wbvs58]

I wouldn't consider 90-91lbs to be that high a birthweight. Bearing in mind that 40kg is 88lb, my Angus heifers this year had the following birthweights, 40.5,39,44,42,41,38.5,& 46.5kg. All were bulls except the 38.5kg a heifer. Three I did help and the 46.5kg was backwards and dead when it hit the ground. They were by low birthweight bulls, half were by SAV Thunderbird whose accuracy is 97% on BW and I would say they were the easiest of these calves. Overall I would say these BW's were higher than similar mature cows calving to the same bulls. I do think I may have overdone the feed a bit with them but overall I am happy with the result. The heifers are certainly the highest risk group with calving and losing one occaisionally while not good is what I expect. I would be worried if it happened every year and would take further steps to prevent it. I generally go middle of the road with birthweight and watch them closely and accept the risk.
Ken

 

[Nesikep]

Welcome to CT...

You don't mention how hard it was to pull these calves. Unless the bull was a blockhead or had other terrible traits that make his calves hang up, I don't see why you should have had so much problem, especially with two year old heifers. We used to breed at 2 years old as well, and gave up on it, w weren't finding any real benefit to it, and as we were trying to build the herd, it wasn't working for us.
Since we've gone back to breeding them at 14 months, we've had to help a couple along the way, but out of the 15 or so in the last 5 years, only one was a real (*&*^ of a pull, a 112 lb bull, both cow and calf survived. We have only one bull, and usually the bull calves (from heifers) are in the 80-90 lb range, and heifers about 70-80.
So except for a badly shaped calves, your Limo heifers don't sound like they have the pelvis needed to deliver a calf, 90 lbs, while a moderate size for a heifer, certainly shouldn't have caused this kind of loss.

If you have your bull's registration number and want help interpreting his number, I'm sure some folks here could help you out with that and see if it's his fault.

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

Whats the birth weight on the heifers? I would expect mine to have a 90# calf.

 

[BucknerLimFlex]

The EPD's on the bull are quite low. Even looking back three generations, all BW have been low for this line of genetics. We are looking into their being some horrible trait picked up within the bull though. The heifer's weigh 1,200 pounds so they are big enough to be calving. Their pelvic's are of normal size, too. This is the first time we have ever had such drastic calving problems. It's usual to expect heifers to have issues while calving, but this is just mind-blowing. I suspect a high nutrient feed in the last trimester months could lead to this problem..
Thank you everyone for your input. It is much appreciated.

 

[Lucky_P]

Do the heifers have a common sire? Perhaps one with really poor maternal calving ease epds?
Some sires are noted for siring daughters with small pelvic areas. Might be big, growthy girls, with a small or misshapen pelvic space.
Increased protein nutrition during the last trimester will generally result in higher birthweights, but in general, is not associated with an increased incidence of dystocia.
However, if these heifers are overly fat... well, there you go... bigger calf, and less 'wiggle room' coming through the birth canal due to all the the extra fat in the pelvic cavity.

 

[Gators Rule]

Hmmmm...I would first look to the bull as being the problem, and then their diet in the last trimester. You mentioned the bull calves were dead when pulled. Were they alive at the outset of the pulling process? Were any of your older cows bred to this bull? If yes, how'd they do?

Secondly, I am very sorry to hear that ya'll are having problems!!! I know that is nerve racking!!

 

[Limomike]

The EPD's on the bull are quite low. Even looking back three generations, all BW have been low for this line of genetics. We are looking into their being some horrible trait picked up within the bull though. The heifer's weigh 1,200 pounds so they are big enough to be calving. Their pelvic's are of normal size, too. This is the first time we have ever had such drastic calving problems. It's usual to expect heifers to have issues while calving, but this is just mind-blowing. I suspect a high nutrient feed in the last trimester months could lead to this problem..
Thank you everyone for your input. It is much appreciated.

I suspect that as well. You also dont mention what the BW was of your bull.. or calving ease EPD. Is this the first time you have used him?
I say give em another shot. with another bull.. AND dont feed em any high protein or nutrient feed, in that last trimester.