2 Buck deer in a cave

[kenny thomas]

I own some land, around 60 acres, that i only visit every few years. I have a brother and a nephew that hunts it some. Mostly timber but a good investment. There is a cave on it that the entrance is 28 ft straight down.
Today my brother called and said some Amish people came and told him they had been in my cave and there was 2 8 point bucks in it.
First issue is i had told 1 of the Amish he wasnt allowed to be there.
Second, the cave is pretty hard to find so he had been there more than once i bet.
My brother got one of the deer out but it was dead and wasnt worth keeping. The other one had broken its horns off and crawled into an area too small for my brother to get into. He said he could see it but it was in bad shape also but alive. He said he couldn't shoot it because of how it was in the hole.
I hate to see any deer wasted but guess this one might be.
Im pretty pissed about the Amish guy, a 20 something year old adult, taking other people in there to begin with. He has been told he wasnt allowed to hunt there but guess he didn't think that included going to the cave. Probably isn't 5 people that knows the cave is there and its hard to find. so its not his first time on my property. Im going to complain to the Bishop of the Amish Community in the area. Better than fussing or wasting time calling the sheriff.

 

[M.Magis]

Telling Amish they're not allowed to trespass is like telling the chickens to stay out of the flowed bed. Not only has he been there many times, so has the rest of his family.

 

[kenny thomas]

Telling Amish they're not allowed to trespass is like telling the chickens to stay out of the flowed bed. Not only has he been there many times, so has the rest of his family.

Until the Amish started a community in my area i had a image of them being the perfect people. Not so much now.
But i think back 50 years when nobody cared if i hunted or fished on their property. Visited several caves without even knowing the landowner. Maybe im being to harsh but it made me mad because this one guy i dont like and he is the one that took the others.
I wonder now how many times they go on my place. We planted ginseng seed there 25 year ago and dont want it bothered. Guess im too cranky in my old age.

 

[M.Magis]

Have you checked your ginseng lately? I can promise, they know where every plant is. Around here they'll have their drivers drop them by the dozen on property they like, private or not. Mushroom season, ginseng season, deer season, etc…. And seasons are only suggestions to them. Just like limits and any other game laws. Maybe other places are different, but I'd be surprised. They have zero respect for other people property.

 

[farmerjan]

The Amish are far from the perfect people... I have dealt with many of them over the years... Mennonites etc... believe me... they are the most self centered, think they are better than .... group of people I have ever met overall... and everything has a "money value on it" .... there is no caring, sentimental feelings in any of them for any animal or anything. Do you know that the amish have more "puppy mills" than any other group of people...

I would definitely complain to the bishop, and your brother and whoever should keep a watch out... REPORT THEM for trespassing... and do not think that they haven't been ginseng hunting/gathering... they are all for themselves/and even amongst their community... they are still for themselves.....

Post it with no Trespassing signs and if someone gets caught... PROSECUTE THEM..... pictures of them on some game cameras that they don't know are there...might be warranted.
I wouldn't trust any of them because they have a feeling they are "superior" to the "english" (US).....

 

[RDFF]

Yup, game cameras, and prosecution.

 

[SmokinM]

Very far from perfect people. Other than solid wood furniture I wouldn't buy anything from them and sure as heck not livestock, especially horses. As for trespassing they are pretty good at that too.

Cool story about the cave though. A pretty neat feature to have on your land.

 

[kenny thomas]

Have you checked your ginseng lately? I can promise, they know where every plant is. Around here they'll have their drivers drop them by the dozen on property they like, private or not. Mushroom season, ginseng season, deer season, etc…. And seasons are only suggestions to them. Just like limits and any other game laws. Maybe other places are different, but I'd be surprised. They have zero respect for other people property.

I hadn't been on the property in over 2 years but i definitely will check the ginseng now. And it will get posted. This Amish guys house is 50 yards from one corner of the property. Im betting he has trespassed a lot. It will get posted.

 

[jltrent]

I have many Amish neighbors and try to take the good with the bad. So far other than a couple times the good has outweighed the bad so far. I got them to build and repair some buildings less than half what everybody else wanted (their work is second to none) and about 40 came to my house at Christmas an sang Christmas songs I have them on camera and those women can out sing any church in the country (amazing). Also, they have driven up land prices around me which can be good or bad. From a good source there is at least 50 more families wanted to settle close to me so if I ever sell, I should be able too. I think my Amish neighbor is a good but there can always be some not so. I sold a house to one that was pretty hard to deal with (the house has been sold twice to another Amish since) if I had it to do over, I wouldn't have sold to that one.

Kenny, I understand your trespassing concerns cause you pay taxes and there shouldn't be other people on your land.

Kenny, the cave is neat.

I have a cave next to the river which I have not been to in at least 10 years, but one time I remember going in and somebody had their weed curing out in it. I got the heck out of there cause those people will shoot you. I had a good idea who it was, but best to be neighborly.

 

[Brute 23]

Cell cameras if you think there is service there.

 

[Logan52]

While I agree the Amish tend to be tight with a dollar, clannish, and sometimes less than generous in business dealings: that is how they have survived and flourished in an economy that does few favors to their way of life.
My home was built by Amish contractors nearly 30 years ago and I regularly attend their produce and hay auctions. I have watched them grow up from young boys to become men with families.
Their world is in some ways like the one I grew up in. As a boy my friends and I felt the whole county was open to us and we were generally tolerated. We visited many wild caves that we had no idea who the owner was. We were wrong but did not see it at the time.
I would rather have Amish as neighbors than many of the "English" that are flocking to the countryside around here.

 

[farmerjan]

I will totally agree that the Amish are superb craftsman when it comes to building. For the most part, they have a good work ethic. And yes, there are very good decent ones... but they as a whole put themselves above the average person.
That said, I have a couple friends, younger people, that have left their "orders" and have talked to me about some of the things that caused them to do so, and the stories are not pleasant.

Being shrewd in business is one thing, but they can be alot worse than "less than generous". They are very good at taking advantage of someone because of the very image they project of being such plain decent people.....

Many do not respect boundaries, like not trespassing, if there is no one around to enforce it.

Yes, kids will go places and do things they are not supposed to do. Especially adventurous boys. However, when told not to be on a property, they often do not believe that it applies to them... have seen that first hand. And the guy @kenny thomas referred to is not a kid....

What if one fell in this cave and got hurt... could not get out... worse scenario than the deer.
Might be kenny needs to cover up the "hole" into the cave.....

 

[kenny thomas]

I have many Amish neighbors and try to take the good with the bad. So far other than a couple times the good has outweighed the bad so far. I got them to build and repair some buildings less than half what everybody else wanted (their work is second to none) and about 40 came to my house at Christmas an sang Christmas songs I have them on camera and those women can out sing any church in the country (amazing). Also, they have driven up land prices around me which can be good or bad. From a good source there is at least 50 more families wanted to settle close to me so if I ever sell, I should be able too. I think my Amish neighbor is a good but there can always be some not so. I sold a house to one that was pretty hard to deal with (the house has been sold twice to another Amish since) if I had it to do over, I wouldn't have sold to that one.

Kenny, I understand your trespassing concerns cause you pay taxes and there shouldn't be other people on your land.

Kenny, the cave is neat.

I have a cave next to the river which I have not been to in at least 10 years, but one time I remember going in and somebody had their weed curing out in it. I got the heck out of there cause those people will shoot you. I had a good idea who it was, but best to be neighborly.

I agree most of the community is good, i really like your neighbor and most of the others. But this one just keeps being pushy. The fact that he went to the cave after being told not to plus took other people just pissed me off.
I sold 22 acres of land joining him a couple years ago because i could see we weren't going to get along. He told me that I was going to have to pay 1/2 on updating a cattle fence so it would keep his sheep in. I didn't have sheep and didn't have cattle on that land. He offered to buy it if i would hold it for a year and take 70% of what i sold it for a week later.
Think i will go today and try to buy it back.

 

[kenny thomas]

Cell cameras if you think there is service there.

No cell service there.

 

[kenny thomas]

I will totally agree that the Amish are superb craftsman when it comes to building. For the most part, they have a good work ethic. And yes, there are very good decent ones... but they as a whole put themselves above the average person.
That said, I have a couple friends, younger people, that have left their "orders" and have talked to me about some of the things that caused them to do so, and the stories are not pleasant.

Being shrewd in business is one thing, but they can be alot worse than "less than generous". They are very good at taking advantage of someone because of the very image they project of being such plain decent people.....

Many do not respect boundaries, like not trespassing, if there is no one around to enforce it.

Yes, kids will go places and do things they are not supposed to do. Especially adventurous boys. However, when told not to be on a property, they often do not believe that it applies to them... have seen that first hand. And the guy @kenny thomas referred to is not a kid....

What if one fell in this cave and got hurt... could not get out... worse scenario than the deer.
Might be kenny needs to cover up the "hole" into the cave.....

Im going to fence it off with wire panels this week. Keep the animals out at least.

 

[4hfarms]

Awesome craftsmen, built our greenhouse and haybarn in 2 days.

Got drunk on our beer in the basement fridge and drove his drivers truck through the property, multiple times! Told us how many times he got reprimanded by the church. He doesn't care. He does what he wants because there are no repercussions from his actions. He said he doesn't have to wake up early on Sun mornings when he is shuned. Heard from one of his workers that he fell off the deep edge. Charges excessive prices now. Took a ladies roof off and had rain that night, he walked away from the job. Went on vacation.

Just another day in Amish paradise.

 

[kenny thomas]

All the above stories i would have thought were false just a few years ago. Not any more.
Although I have not seen them drunk yet a niece that drives them daily said she had to stop at the liquor store for them. But they wouldn't go in and buy it. She had to buy it for them and then they paid her.

 

[M.Magis]

While I agree the Amish tend to be tight with a dollar, clannish, and sometimes less than generous in business dealings: that is how they have survived and flourished in an economy that does few favors to their way of life.

Economy that does them no favors? Seriously? Maybe the amish around you haven't figured out how to take advantage of the system, but I doubt that. Go to any land auction around here and there's a good chance it gets sold to an amish person. Who pays cash. A drive through their communities and you'll see large businesses with all the modern machinery you can imagine, and of course they pay no taxes. Their wives are mowing the grass with $20k mowers. Modern equipment is okay with them as long as "its for the business".
There's usually a family or two that breed a shyt ton of dogs to make "designer" puppies and sell them for thousands to city people. The females are bred back to back to back, then "disposed of" when she's too worn out to have more pups. Which doesn't take long with their system.
I do know of some old school amish that won't even ride bicycles, but they aren't the norm any more.

 

[Springfieldsimm]

Economy that does them no favors? Seriously? Maybe the amish around you haven't figured out how to take advantage of the system, but I doubt that. Go to any land auction around here and there's a good chance it gets sold to an amish person. Who pays cash. A drive through their communities and you'll see large businesses with all the modern machinery you can imagine, and of course they pay no taxes. Their wives are mowing the grass with $20k mowers. Modern equipment is okay with them as long as "its for the business".
There's usually a family or two that breed a shyt ton of dogs to make "designer" puppies and sell them for thousands to city people. The females are bred back to back to back, then "disposed of" when she's too worn out to have more pups. Which doesn't take long with their system.
I do know of some old school amish that won't even ride bicycles, but they aren't the norm any more.

I disagree on the paying no taxes. They pay taxes just like any other person and in Ohio they pay a voluntary road tax so they don't need to have license plates on their buggies.

 

[kenny thomas]

I disagree on the paying no taxes. They pay taxes just like any other person and in Ohio they pay a voluntary road tax so they don't need to have license plates on their buggies.

They pay taxes here except Social Security. No road tax yet but kinda needs to be.
Many of the Amish here use farm tractors as a part of their transportation and mostly use the buggies on Sunday's.
We have farm tractors on roads some also but not as much as them so we haven't pushed for road taxes on farm tractors.