14 mth. old bull calf nursing two cows ? What to do?

[never2old2learn-ron]

Ron,

When you say thay your old bull could eat and drink at the water tank. Did you have automatic waters with balls to push down?

No. I went back and reread your original post and seen where you mentioned the automatic waterer. That might make it hard or impossible for him to drink. Ours are all open stock tanks. Ron

 

[KNERSIE]

FWIW, the plastic calf weaner at the bottom of Aero's link works better for me than any other type of nosering I've tried over the years. I have 95%+ success rate with the plastic spikey nosering, but there are always that 5% of calves that are either too clever for the nosering, or the cow's teats are too long or a combination of both.

In my experience if yearling and older cattle learned that they can still suckle only the stun gun from the butcher will stop them.

Just another hypothetical question....
Even if the nosering works.... how are you going to know it works? Its not like weaning a calf where you can clearly see the udder is full if the nosering is doing its job.

When is the next BSE date?

 

[BARNSCOOP]

The next BSE is in June. I have him separated from the nursing cows right now. If I had an appliance of any kind I would be able to see if it worked because I have a small farm (17 head right now) at my house and the cattle are all in front pastures. I see them alot during the day and I bucket feed them daily to take a very close look. My big problem is lack of space. I have a small farm designed to keep the herd all together and rotate pastures. I have a lot that I put calves in to grain out that is separate and currently has two beaves graining out. As it is I have cattle in all the pastures with no way to rotate because of keeping him away from some young heifers and nursing cows. If he passes the BSE I believe I will TRY something of some sort so I can use him this breeding season and put the herd back together then after they are all breed he will be grained out to kill. If he doesn't pass....well...I have a back up secured but I have three of the back ups daughters and I am back to having pasture problems. To beat it all a heifer a purchased a few months ago was supposed to be a year old in February started making a bag yesterday!!! She has never been around a bull at my place so....... she had to have been bred by her sire and at a young age!!! Sometimes I think of selling all the cows and the bull and just buying weaned calves to keep for a year and sell to our beef customers!! I just don't see the money in it.

 

[Aero]

how are you going to know it works? Its not like weaning a calf where you can clearly see the udder is full if the nosering is doing its job.

well, this is a matter of survival for me. In reality, I have no other easy choice right now for breeding the cows and even after salvage value, another bull is going to cost me $700-$1000 more if I just go buy one instead of making it to next year to use my own (which I prefer genetically).

do you think there is any extra pounds in using these things before weaning or is it just for convenience?

 

[KNERSIE]

how are you going to know it works? Its not like weaning a calf where you can clearly see the udder is full if the nosering is doing its job.

well, this is a matter of survival for me. In reality, I have no other easy choice right now for breeding the cows and even after salvage value, another bull is going to cost me $700-$1000 more if I just go buy one instead of making it to next year to use my own (which I prefer genetically).

do you think there is any extra pounds in using these things before weaning or is it just for convenience?

That depends entirely on your operation, if you creep feed and grain the weaned calves hard after weaning then there probably isn't much in it for you, but if you don't creep and don't grain the cattle at all like i do and usually don't even grain the weaned calves then there certainly is much less weaning shock and they just continue to grow like they would have had they never been weaned. (obviously without the added milk supplement for those looking for an argument)

It is also convenient for me in my setup where fenceline weaning isn't always practical, I'd much rather feed 5% of the calves in the corral than feed 100% of them. One added advantage for me is the two knobs of the rings often grow through the septum and ends up in one nostril making a handy hole for the bullcalves' noserings.

As a last thought I don't think the nosering should be used for early weaning, but works great for weaning at the normal 6-8 month bracket

 

[BARNSCOOP]

Can I ask a question here? If my bull is 14 mths old and I try to put one of the nose appliance's in (like the one in your link Aero) and put wire through it as Bez suggested then what is the common way to make the hole through the septum? Would this be a great mess and cause infection?

 

[KNERSIE]

Can I ask a question here? If my bull is 14 mths old and I try to put one of the nose appliance's in (like the one in your link Aero) and put wire through it as Bez suggested then what is the common way to make the hole through the septum? Would this be a great mess and cause infection?

Not sure I understand correctly... but the weaning nosering don't need a hole through the septum, you pull the two ends together by tightening a wingnut. To put a normal bullring in you just push the nosering through using elbow grease, almost no bleeding. You don't go through the cartiledge, you go between the cartiledge and muzzle. I know someone who uses the tool for making the hole in the ear for the old star type eartags, but I just don't see the benefit in this.

Personally I would use the plastic spikey weaning nosering and I would advise against using the barb wire, that is an accident waiting to happen as it WILL get caught on something sooner or later

 

[BARNSCOOP]

Thanks, I was wondering which nosering you had success with and now I can order that one today. Thank you much, Sonya

 

[Bez+]

Can I ask a question here? If my bull is 14 mths old and I try to put one of the nose appliance's in (like the one in your link Aero) and put wire through it as Bez suggested then what is the common way to make the hole through the septum? Would this be a great mess and cause infection?

Not sure I understand correctly... but the weaning nosering don't need a hole through the septum, you pull the two ends together by tightening a wingnut. To put a normal bullring in you just push the nosering through using elbow grease, almost no bleeding. You don't go through the cartiledge, you go between the cartiledge and muzzle. I know someone who uses the tool for making the hole in the ear for the old star type eartags, but I just don't see the benefit in this.

Personally I would use the plastic spikey weaning nosering and I would advise against using the barb wire, that is an accident waiting to happen as it WILL get caught on something sooner or later

Barb wire? Who said anything about that?

The wire holds the tin can on the nose - you want to buy one of those fancy stop suck things you do not need it - we just used an old coffee can when I was younger - but now I would never be bothered - we get rid of them.

You do it the old fashioned way you need wire.

The wire cannot get caught - it goes through the septum - I just make sure it is good and tight. Now that wire can be spring wire, black wire, fencing wire, plastic coated wire, or any kind of wire you want - but barbed? Funny how things get all twisted out of shape.

All this bother is why I get rid of the dammed animal that sucks - Barnscoop - I look forward to you doing all of this if you do not have the infrastructure, roping ability or trap to squeeze - and the knowledge.

I suspect this critter is tougher than you.

Get some help

Have fun and best of luck

Bez+

 

[BARNSCOOP]

Bez,
I have a squeeze shoot, alley way and sweep in the pasture he is in. All under a covered shed. I feed him and three others a bucket of feed everyday in a buck feeder also under that shed. I just close him up and run him through. My plan because of space here on the farm is to see if he passes his BSE. If he does I will install a nose weaner on him and use him this breeding season. If not, I will put him in the grain-out lot and sell him for beef in September. I will watch him this season and see if the nose piece works. After the girls are confirmed bred, there are only 8, I will make a decision as to what I will do next. Somtimes I wonder if A.I. just might be easyer for me because we are so small, to have a bull around is an added burden.

 

[dun]

Somtimes I wonder if A.I. just might be easyer for me because we are so small, to have a bull around is an added burden.

BINGO