Commercial home kept bulls

Discuss the advantages and disadvantages of your favorite breed.

User avatar
Jeanne - Simme Valley
GURU
GURU
Posts: 8255
Joined: Thu Dec 09, 2004 6:46 am
Location: Central Upstate New York
Contact:

Re: Commercial home kept bulls

Postby Jeanne - Simme Valley » Mon Feb 12, 2018 11:10 am

"Also, some farmers are keeping the smaller heifers so that they will raise smaller cows and thus be able to run more cattle. More cattle means more calves which means more money."

That is a very broad statement that is very controversial. I just wanted to point that out to any "newbies" reading. This is an age old "argument" which you can find research backing and going against this statement.
Here is a good article:
https://www.drovers.com/article/what-ideal-cow-size
0 x
Simme Valley of New York - http://www.SimmeValley.com
"We make a living by what we get,
we make a life by what we give."

User avatar
True Grit Farms
GURU
GURU
Posts: 5417
Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2016 5:29 pm
Location: Middle Georgia

Re: Commercial home kept bulls

Postby True Grit Farms » Mon Feb 12, 2018 9:53 pm

I invariably keep my smaller framed heifers back, which doesn't seem to hurt. I sell most my heifers off the farm and everyone wants the biggest. You can do a lot of things by using different bulls for different things. But you sure can't do much with a commercial bull besides hope for a live calf.
0 x
If we'd of know this we'd of picked our own cotton.

User avatar
Big Cheese
Rancher
Rancher
Posts: 829
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2015 11:07 am
Location: Southwest Arkansas

Re: Commercial home kept bulls

Postby Big Cheese » Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:14 am

Jeanne - Simme Valley wrote:"Also, some farmers are keeping the smaller heifers so that they will raise smaller cows and thus be able to run more cattle. More cattle means more calves which means more money."

That is a very broad statement that is very controversial. I just wanted to point that out to any "newbies" reading. This is an age old "argument" which you can find research backing and going against this statement.
Here is a good article:
https://www.drovers.com/article/what-ideal-cow-size


I read the article and it is a very good article. There could be some truth to it but its different on our farm. Our cows range from 900-1300 pounds (with some bigger then that and smaller then that) and our smaller cows raise bigger calves then our bigger cows. The "small" heifers that we retain get just as big as our other cows and raise just as good and most of the time better calves.

We keep the smaller heifers (at this moment however we are keeping every heifer so that we can build our herd up) so that we can run more cows since they are smaller and also feed less in the winter time. It is cost efficient for us to do this. They eat less hay in the winter which cuts down on a big time cost. Mainly though, our big cows just aren't as good as our small cows with calf production.

The smaller cows also work way better during the hot summer time as well. When its 100 degrees they are still out grazing when the bigger cows are in the shade. It just works best for us to do it this way, it may not for other farmers in other parts of the country but it does for us.
0 x

Ebenezer
Rancher
Rancher
Posts: 759
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2015 12:46 pm

Re: Commercial home kept bulls

Postby Ebenezer » Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:04 am

"Small" is hard to get out of a herd one you have bred it in or built it in. Take a small (short) calf to a livestock barn and watch $125 to $175 not come home on the check. Promoting small cows is lipstick on a pig. Breed for what you want and for something that others will pay for. Fire and ice matings generally make puddles of water. Except at newsletters, conferences and specialty situations, it is not "small" that is in demand. Your best cow is the cow that goes unnoticed for the longest. Your best heifers are generally in the middle as they more truly represent the genes in the herd. To have a few great cows means that you have mostly average to below average cows. I'd rather have all to average 100 because then I know I have a overall decent herd.
3 x

User avatar
Big Cheese
Rancher
Rancher
Posts: 829
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2015 11:07 am
Location: Southwest Arkansas

Re: Commercial home kept bulls

Postby Big Cheese » Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:58 pm

All of our cows are average to above average to great cows. If they aren't they are culled out and replaced. We have been picking through our herd for 4 years now retaining and replacing and we have very few cows that don't produce really good calves. Now we have some cows that are getting age on them and are at the point of culling and we also have some young cows that aren't producing like they should. We are picking and choosing as they come.

I said in my earlier post that we have been keeping all of our heifers because we are wanting to get our numbers up so we are keeping all shape and sizes. What I was saying by the "Smaller" heifer instead of your biggest and best is that the smaller heifer will eventually become a good size cow if you give it time. You will probably have to put it with a bull at 2.5 years instead of 2 but if you wait they will become a great cow. Also, a bigger cow does not always mean better calves i've seen it happen a lot. I had a cow that weighed 1300 pounds and she was raising calves that barely weighed 400 pounds and not having calves on time....we had 750 pound longhorns that were raising calves 500+ so she wasn't what we wanted....she is no longer with our herd.....lol I got a good bit of money for her though when I sold her!
0 x

User avatar
Jeanne - Simme Valley
GURU
GURU
Posts: 8255
Joined: Thu Dec 09, 2004 6:46 am
Location: Central Upstate New York
Contact:

Re: Commercial home kept bulls

Postby Jeanne - Simme Valley » Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:33 pm

Ebenezer - that was very well put. I didn't dig for more articles, but the older ones always promoted 'small" cows, but the more modern ones hit on what you pointed out. Small frame feeders lose money at the sale barns. A 500# small vs a 500# large frame calf gets a different price.
Price of cull cows, price of feeder calves all come into the formula for profit.
I used to have frame 7-9 cows - because this is what made me the most money on the breeding stock. Now, I will guess most of my herd is about 5.5. They weigh up there, but are short & wide. Herd average is maybe 1500-1550#
0 x
Simme Valley of New York - http://www.SimmeValley.com
"We make a living by what we get,
we make a life by what we give."

User avatar
True Grit Farms
GURU
GURU
Posts: 5417
Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2016 5:29 pm
Location: Middle Georgia

Re: Commercial home kept bulls

Postby True Grit Farms » Tue Feb 13, 2018 4:40 pm

Jeanne - Simme Valley wrote:Ebenezer - that was very well put. I didn't dig for more articles, but the older ones always promoted 'small" cows, but the more modern ones hit on what you pointed out. Small frame feeders lose money at the sale barns. A 500# small vs a 500# large frame calf gets a different price.
Price of cull cows, price of feeder calves all come into the formula for profit.
I used to have frame 7-9 cows - because this is what made me the most money on the breeding stock. Now, I will guess most of my herd is about 5.5. They weigh up there, but are short & wide. Herd average is maybe 1500-1550#

You have big cows, I sold my biggest cow ever, she was 1625 lbs and the biggest beef cow that I've ever seen.
0 x
If we'd of know this we'd of picked our own cotton.

User avatar
Jeanne - Simme Valley
GURU
GURU
Posts: 8255
Joined: Thu Dec 09, 2004 6:46 am
Location: Central Upstate New York
Contact:

Re: Commercial home kept bulls

Postby Jeanne - Simme Valley » Tue Feb 13, 2018 5:09 pm

I used to have gigunda size cows. But, kids/parents would get out the measuring stick to get the tallest cattle they could find to show. :shock: That was fine, I kept the mediocre ones. But, yeah, I had some 9 frame cows.
I may have some 6.5 frame cows, but I also may have some 4.5. I have to admit, I have a couple old girls over 1800# - that average included them.
0 x
Simme Valley of New York - http://www.SimmeValley.com
"We make a living by what we get,
we make a life by what we give."

User avatar
ALACOWMAN
Mentor
Mentor
Posts: 14540
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2005 4:16 pm
Location: heart of dixie

Re: Commercial home kept bulls

Postby ALACOWMAN » Tue Feb 13, 2018 5:19 pm

Had a simbrah cow that was 1800 pds.One of my bigger ones.. still have a few big framers, That are weaseling their way outa here..
0 x
Santa Claus, the ultimate Yankee....


Return to “Breeds Board”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests