can you explain why you raise the cattle you do?

[Caustic Burno]

So we all know what the CAB is and isnt, so why all the back and forth? Either accept what it is or try to change it.

That's up to you and the other ethical Angus breeders to change the system.

[Anguscattle]

Well, me personally, I have nothing to do with the CAB program. Its a part of our breed. But not a part that I deal with. I try to raise quality cattle that gain on pasture, breed back quick, low bw with a high growth curve to yearling and overall good looking cattle. For replacement heifers and bulls. Thats my focus. I dont really worry about what the CAB is doing.

[Kathie in Thorp]

And honestly, the reason why i say that is bc im confused. I cant tell who is supporting the angus & cab and who is against it. Lol

Anguscattle -- No argument with you, I don't take any side. But I think a lot of folks really don't know about CAB -- they get caught up in the hype, and they get wrapped up in it when they are trying to figure out what to do in start-ups or improvements. I thought, until recently, that CAB was all about purebred Angus. Well, obviously, it isn't. But I think the meat-buying public believes that. And that's thanks to the great advertising by the Angus breeders. Like I said, the registry has done a great marketing job -- hats off to them. But it's not a true picture about what the average American is buying -- they are NOT buying purebred or even high percentage Angus. Just carcass qualities.

[Anguscattle]

I agree with you Katie

[highgrit]

I think its been a win for everybody so far. The price is up across the board no matter the breed. And the consumer is getting a better product. Also beef export is on the rise. I say let the good times roll.

[SANDTRAP]

And honestly, the reason why i say that is bc im confused. I cant tell who is supporting the angus & cab and who is against it. Lol

Anguscattle -- No argument with you, I don't take any side. But I think a lot of folks really don't know about CAB -- they get caught up in the hype, and they get wrapped up in it when they are trying to figure out what to do in start-ups or improvements. I thought, until recently, that CAB was all about purebred Angus. Well, obviously, it isn't. But I think the meat-buying public believes that. And that's thanks to the great advertising by the Angus breeders. Like I said, the registry has done a great marketing job -- hats off to them. But it's not a true picture about what the average American is buying -- they are NOT buying purebred or even high percentage Angus. Just carcass qualities.

Just speculation on my part but I think the packers are for CAB because of the carcass quality and have made no secrect of their losses with poor carcasses.
The consumer couldn't care less if it was Angus or purebred or even know what that is, they are just wanting quality.
The standards for CAB almost gurantees quality,

[Kathie in Thorp]

Sandtrap, I think the CAB standards also point to quality . . . but if it's not ANGUS, then that's sort of a deceit to the public when it's sold as "Certified Angus Beef," and harder on other producers in the market. Looking at the regs, I could sell my white cattle as CAB, if they met carcass quality (and I have no doubt that they would -- but we don't sell to packers).

JMO.

[SANDTRAP]

Sandtrap, I think the CAB standards also point to quality . . . but if it's not ANGUS, then that's sort of a deceit to the public when it's sold as "Certified Angus Beef," and harder on other producers in the market. Looking at the regs, I could sell my white cattle as CAB, if they met carcass quality (and I have no doubt that they would -- but we don't sell to packers).

JMO.

Certified Angus Beef" evaluation if they are at least 51% black and exhibit Angus influence, which include black Simmental cattle and crossbreds However, they must meet all 10 of the following criteria, which were refined in January 2007 to further enhance product consistency, to be labeled "Certified Angus Beef" by USDA Graders:[18]
■Modest or higher degree of marbling
■Medium or fine marbling texture
■"A" maturity
■10 to 16 square-inch ribeye area
■Less than 1,000-pound hot carcass weight
■Less than 1-inch fat thickness
■Moderately thick or thicker muscling
■No hump on the neck exceeding 5 cm (2")
■Practically free of capillary rupture
■No dark cutting characteristics

[Kathie in Thorp]

. . . "at least 51% black" in color? And they meet the other criteria?

[Anguscattle]

Other than other breeds going black, i dont see how the CAB hurts other cattle breeds. Yeah, you cant pass CAB if you dont meet color requirements, but if your cattle are of good quality, they still have a very good market. Just not with the CAB. i guess yall are talking about docking for color at sales? My question is, do you blame AAA for marketing their breed, or do you blame your breed for not marketing good enough?
Everyone knows hereford was the standard back in the day, until angus tore it up with marketing, hereford breed decided not to market their cattle as much. Now angus is the standard. When another breed decides to outmarket angus, they will be the standard. Its business. Raising cattle is a business. And like any good salesman the angus has pitched their product.
Yes, i agree that it may be a tad of deceit since they arent all angus cattle, but its quality of beef too. And AAA does have programs that do require progeny from at least registered sires. The prices of cattle are so high right now, i dont see what everyone is complaining about. EVERYONE is getting good prices! Enjoy it! We all serve consumers one way or another. Therefore i think we all share a common goal. Provide people with good quality beef, and make a little money doing it, regardless of breed or programs.

[plumber_greg]

Kathie, I used to send my calves to a feedlot and sell on grids. WHen the margins got tight, I started selling feeders. I know your customers like your beef, but it's a lot harder than you think to raise CAB certified beef. The most I ever sold was 29 out of a pen of 100 steers and heifers, all black, all mostly angus. That was a good year, usually is around 20%. I've read about and seen steaks that people will say are high choice that they have raised but in reality most would be select grade beef, but still tastes good. I haven't seen your carcasses, so I don't really know, but I question your statement,"(and I have no doubt they would--but we don't sell to packers). It's a lot harder than you think to sell CAB.
respectfully gs

[Caustic Burno]

Other than other breeds going black, i dont see how the CAB hurts other cattle breeds. Yeah, you cant pass CAB if you dont meet color requirements, but if your cattle are of good quality, they still have a very good market. Just not with the CAB. i guess yall are talking about docking for color at sales? My question is, do you blame AAA for marketing their breed, or do you blame your breed for not marketing good enough?
Everyone knows hereford was the standard back in the day, until angus tore it up with marketing, hereford breed decided not to market their cattle as much. Now angus is the standard. When another breed decides to outmarket angus, they will be the standard. Its business. Raising cattle is a business. And like any good salesman the angus has pitched their product.
Yes, i agree that it may be a tad of deceit since they arent all angus cattle, but its quality of beef too. And AAA does have programs that do require progeny from at least registered sires. The prices of cattle are so high right now, i dont see what everyone is complaining about. EVERYONE is getting good prices! Enjoy it! We all serve consumers one way or another. Therefore i think we all share a common goal. Provide people with good quality beef, and make a little money doing it, regardless of breed or programs.

I agree it was pure genius in the begining as they were the only "black cattle", what he AAA didn't see was dang near every other breed turn black overnight to chase the premium. Over a period of time it has become a fraud due to the other breeds turning black and Angus didn't change the rules and IMO have set us all up to take a huge PR hit.
I agree with on Hereford I was a long standing member in the assocation and quit them this year for lack of vision and not spending the money to market the cattle. I had many conversations that fell on deaf ears. Two years ago there were two long term Hereford seedstock producers in my area today none. I have people call every week looking for bulls and can't believe I don't have any, they ask about my running buddy who was breeder and tell them he has went commerical as well. For the first time in over twenty years there are no Hereford bulls standing in my pasture. Neighbors are running the last three I raised. All I could see they were doing with the dues and registration fees was supporting a few workers and the rest who know's. There registering process went to a money making scheme IMO. These cattle associations haven't been our friends in all cases and have done a lot of harm in others going from purebred to fullblood anything to make a dollar for the association . Some of these associations have got to the point they will take any cow as long as one of their bulls drove by in a trailer.
We have let this happen the members that paid the dues to support them.
The whole mess started when it came about chasing black hide and has went straight downhill every sense.
We have created a generation of cattlemen that are color bound not quality and think if it has papers it is quality.

[Anguscattle]

Caustic,

I pretty much agree. But i still think the hereford has a lot to offer. They just need to market more.

[SRBeef]

I think the Hereford association is one of the few if not only association working to keep the bloodlines pure and true. their new requirement to have DNA samples on all bulls born after Jan 1 of last year before progeny can be registered is a good one. It adds some cost but I think will be proved worthwhile in the long run.

Caustic, I understand why some breeders got out of Herefords under the pressure to go black (I appreciate the admission of a "little deceit" above) but even a small, commercial, freezer beef guy like me is getting calls looking for a Hereford bull this year.

I think the "black" house of cards is about to crash down. Many buyers now realize it's the quality of the beef, not the hide color, that is important.

Folks are seeing the benefits of heterosis and looking for good Hereford bulls to put on all these black cows around. Your neighbors may wish they were still in the Hereford bull business.

Jim

[Anguscattle]

Cant beat a good old angus hereford X, with a little brangus thrown in for the heat tolerance! Dang they look good! Personal opinion of course.