E.P.A Visit

[Jogeephus]

yes, I am doing that now and calling lawyer.

Just my opinion but I wouldn't worry with the lawyer until you get some other professional opinions on the matter. My suspicion is that this will blow away and this is just the opinion of an overzealous inexperienced official who got to drive her truck by herself for the first day. Good luck with it and let us know if there are some new federal regulations that we all need to know about.

[skyhightree1]

I will let everyone know.

[HerefordSire]

Enviromental protection agency paid me a visit today... told me I was doing something illegal by letting my cattle and my neighbors cattle drink out of my pond and be able to get in the water... has anyone ever heard this before ? told me i needed to fence the cattle atleast 30 feet away from the pond and also install a watering system for them. Said this was to cut down on pollution. Is this true?

Is your pond and cattle visible from the road?

[SRBeef]

I think if you calmly looked at the situation it might be more cost effective to put in a waterer than to pay lawyers.

There may be more to this than meets the eye also.

I have a dam which seasonally collects water behind it. I have a concrete waterer not more than 100 ft away with some of the best well water in the world. Where do the calves especially go for a drink??? You guessed it - the almost stagnant pond water! They wade out in the middle bend down to take a drink while at the same time often dropping manure out the other end and right into the same water they are drinking. This is a real source of potential parasite infections etc.

I now run an electric wire around the pond at the dam most of the year.

If you want to pay a lawyer and complain about "the current situation in Washington" by all means go ahead. Note that "Washington" will probably pay all or most of the cost of making the change, as pointed out above.

Personally I'd put up a single wire and put in a waterer. You likely will come out ahead cost wise and cattle health wise compared to complaining and lawyers. jmho.

Jim

[AngusLimoX]

If you want to pay a lawyer and complain about "the current situation in Washington" by all means go ahead. Note that "Washington" will probably pay all or most of the cost of making the change, as pointed out above.

Personally I'd put up a single wire and put in a waterer. You likely will come out ahead cost wise and cattle health wise compared to complaining and lawyers. jmho.
Jim

Big difference between complaining and having situational awareness.

The original drafts of our clean water laws prohibited ruminants from crapping on any open ground water source. After millions spent on that draft someone, likely a farmer, pointed out that snow was actually frozen water. Back to the drawing board.
These people are not there to serve or help you.

That being said, the rest of your advice is excellent. Can't forget lepto as well if you have any deer in the area. I am doing the same thing, except I won't take a penny from the govt.

[skyhightree1]

Yes, cattle can be seen from a secondary road. My lawyer I pay per month incase I need him so it wont cost anything for me to have him look into it. I understand what you all are saying im not getting mad but I just wish that gov't would mind there own business and use our money in a better manor than to mess with the small farmers.

[grannysoo]

These people are not there to serve or help you.

But I thought the gubmint was here to hep us.........

[mack]

Let me first say tha I am NO expert or AUTHORITY on this matter... but I did remember reading about this exact subject in last months NCBA magazine. See the link.

http://www.beefusa.org/NEWSCleanWaterRestorationActThreatensRanchersSmallBusinessOwners39120.aspx

As of RIGHT NOW, it appears that the EPA has NO authority whatsoever over a farm pond (not navigable water). However, this is in the process of being changed in the Clean Water Restoration Act. The EPA lady may have been a little early with her visit.

I am a huge supporter of fencing off ponds from a cattle health and gain standpoint. However, I want the freedom to do it on my own accord. If Big Brother told me that I HAD TO DO IT, then I would probably tear all of the fences out and let the cows have at it belly deep in mud. I guess you could say that it makes me feel good to be a steward to the environment not a slave to the environment.

I assume that there were no citations issued... since there is no legal backing for them.

It's almost tempting to send an anonymous email to the EPA politely asking them about the subject.

[hillrancher]

Not an lawyer but have had many visit from the epa and adeq over the past 15 years on various insidents. The state owns the water your pond or lake is wet lands you cannot drain or damage the water. You can drain and rebuild but you cannot fillin or destroy.
My expereince is that some one has snitched they have to make a report. Do nothing until the man with the badge come out with the papers. He most likley will never come. Get a good nights sleep and forget about it.

[mack]

As of right now, there is no Virginia Dept of Environmental Quality or US EPA regulation that states that cattle cannot drink and roam in farm ponds.

The USDA-NRCS even has provisions under EQIP to cost share for gravel and fabric to allow limited access for cattle into ponds, streams and cricks.

A law like that would be about as well received as outlawing string on hay.

[Jogeephus]

A law like that would be about as well received as outlawing string on hay.

However, this is in the process of being changed in the Clean Water Restoration Act. The EPA lady may have been a little early with her visit.

I agree completely with what you have said. The EPA wants this authority terribly bad and have been trying to get it for some years now. The little ear-ring wearing queerish fella that visited me all but said that. He was trying to enforce the law as he thought it ought to be. Trouble for him is I knew the law and I knew what I was doing was within the law and I had the support of the NRCS office so I was able to stand my ground and counter every false claim he made. He was no more than an anoyance but he did waste my time and money and it infuriated me that we were paying this fools salary. If they ever get this power, God help us. BTW - this isn't political this is just pure fact. You can believe what you want.

[tncattle467]

Yes, cattle can be seen from a secondary road. My lawyer I pay per month incase I need him so it wont cost anything for me to have him look into it. I understand what you all are saying im not getting mad but I just wish that gov't would mind there own business and use our money in a better manor than to mess with the small farmers.

Fortunately my lawyer is my best friend and a fellow cattleman so he works for me for free. I go and help him on his 500 acres sometimes to work off what I owe. I dont have to do that but I do.

[skyhightree1]

I got final word from EPA... they frowned on me cutting into the spring but since I filled it back in and used wetlands grass seed and put it back basically the way it was they said theres really nothing they can do right now but wish I would fence the cows off the pond and install waterers. So I am good but they told me not to interfere with the spring and tie into it.

[AngusLimoX]

Cool that you let us know, so many don't.

[skyhightree1]

Cool that you let us know, so many don't.

no problem angus... the lady thought i was still tied into the natural spring but it had been filled in for years. They told me I shouldnt tie into it again if I can help it.. I told them no problem I can run my 6 inch water pump and fill it back up if need be. They definately jumped the gun on that one she admitted. I am relieved I was right and could tell big brother to kiss my @#$