Jersey Genetics? HELP!!!

[regolith]

Deacon, Joskin, Zues, Aim, and Henry these are the sires in the dairy mans tank.
here's the link to the catalog :http://www.licnz.com/sire_catalogue2.cfm
Valerie

http://lic.co.nz/lic_RAS_Lists1.cfm?ab_ ... 03&ps_id=2
Aim is Maunga/Manhatten background, first proof, good production but management and udder traits very average and I wouldn't touch a minus rated fertility. Supplementary pedigree

http://lic.co.nz/lic_Sire_Lineup.cfm?ab ... info_id=13
Joskin high production, great fertility, not so good management traits. He's a Manhatten son. Pedigree. I marked him in the '11 catalogue as a possible for my herd, chose against him because of the temperament and Manhatten link.

http://lic.co.nz/lic_Sire_Lineup.cfm?ab ... info_id=13
Zeus lower production, very good management (temperament) and udders. Main thing to watch for is the high rump angle... I can see it in his heifers that I have. Panache/Casper, bit of Fjord... looks like he might be linebred (deliberately?) with Admiral repeating several times. Also pedigree.

I think Deacon may be Deeno's full brother... I have 2 yr heifers to Deeno this year. Kept a Henry calf last spring. Both are off the LIC list, might find them on www.aeu.org.nz

[regolith]

http://www.aeu.org.nz/sire_detail.cfm?i ... 7CD3C79790
Henry - Maunga/Ace. I like his components%, slight negative rump angle he's generally unremarkable in every trait.

Yes, Deacon is brother to one of the bulls I used in 08, now milking daughters to. I thought I chose the better brother
http://www.aeu.org.nz/sire_detail.cfm?i ... 0D21251E3E
Looking at that... wouldn't waste anything on this bull. Low production, low fertility, poor management traits.
I'm happy with my Deeno daughters... all except one, and she's improved vastly since the spring.

If it were me I'd be choosing between Zeus and Henry, with Joskin a highly suspect third choice.
Which catalogue is that? The 2012 one should be out within a couple of weeks, the link you posted killed my connection. The very last page should give you current average BVs for each breed which is helpful to compare with the bull BVs (breeding values) - (it'll tell you if the bull is an improvement on the average NZ Jersey cow for that trait or not)

[regolith]

You've probably seen this already - found the catalogue link on there too, it's not the same one we see in NZ http://www.licnz.com/sire_team6.cfm?
Deeno and Deacon aren't brothers - I think it's uncle/nephew can't quite make my brain work it out. One is Deena's son the other her grandson.

[vclavin]

Regolith , thanks. You confirmed what I had. But I also crosses Deacon off my list. That leaves me with Zeus. I haven't figured out how to tell a heifer safe bull from one that should only be used on cows.
Also, if there's one in the catalog that really stands out to you and is safe to use on heifers, let me know. Maybe I can get him to order the semen for me. From your info, it is obious he is not good at picking bulls yet (he hasn't been doing this for long)
thanks.
Valerie

[regolith]

They are all heifer safe.
If you look in the catalogues you'll see a BV for 'calving difficulty'. As long as it's a minus value (and they all are) you're good to go on heifers.
I did manage to download the US catalogue and save it to my computer so I'll have another look through later.

[vclavin]

They are all heifer safe.
If you look in the catalogues you'll see a BV for 'calving difficulty'. As long as it's a minus value (and they all are) you're good to go on heifers.
I did manage to download the US catalogue and save it to my computer so I'll have another look through later.

Thanks so much for your help. I really appreciate your taking time to do this.
Valerie

[regolith]

My 2012 LIC catalogue arrived this morning!
Others you might want to look at: Target, Genius, Supernova, Jester. All are slightly larger than average, all except Genius are Manhatten sons or grandsons. Management traits aren't that great for Target, SCC BV (disposition towards mastitis) is poor on Genius' proof.
If I order any from LIC this year I may give Supernova and Jester a try, being careful not to use Jester on any slow milking cows. Jester isn't *yet* listed on the US team.
George is the current number 1 bull... doesn't appeal to me though with fairly low management traits, steep rump angle and his proof indicates wide teat placement.

[vclavin]

My 2012 LIC catalogue arrived this morning!
Others you might want to look at: Target, Genius, Supernova, Jester. All are slightly larger than average, all except Genius are Manhatten sons or grandsons. Management traits aren't that great for Target, SCC BV (disposition towards mastitis) is poor on Genius' proof.
If I order any from LIC this year I may give Supernova and Jester a try, being careful not to use Jester on any slow milking cows. Jester isn't *yet* listed on the US team.
George is the current number 1 bull... doesn't appeal to me though with fairly low management traits, steep rump angle and his proof indicates wide teat placement.

I thought Iwas supposed to stay away from Manhatten? Are there exceptions?
valerie

[regolith]

I thought Iwas supposed to stay away from Manhatten? Are there exceptions?
valerie

That's why I tell you which ones they are. Put it this way... I've been through every bull in the 'classic daughter proven jersey' section of my new catalogue and in my opinion four of them are worth considering. Three of those are related to Manhatten.
Both Ambreed and LIC have told me they are confident in breeding sons from him and distributing them widely. You need to know that some of Manhatten's calves have been born with abnormalities of the hind legs/spine.
I already have his daughters in my herd and if I have to put down such a calf it's one heifer out of forty or fifty, so it's a calculated risk if I use his genetics. Just know what the risk is if you look at these bulls.

[vclavin]

I thought Iwas supposed to stay away from Manhatten? Are there exceptions?
valerie

That's why I tell you which ones they are. Put it this way... I've been through every bull in the 'classic daughter proven jersey' section of my new catalogue and in my opinion four of them are worth considering. Three of those are related to Manhatten.
Both Ambreed and LIC have told me they are confident in breeding sons from him and distributing them widely. You need to know that some of Manhatten's calves have been born with abnormalities of the hind legs/spine.
I already have his daughters in my herd and if I have to put down such a calf it's one heifer out of forty or fifty, so it's a calculated risk if I use his genetics. Just know what the risk is if you look at these bulls.

Is there a test for the defect to use culling? As I only have 3 girls, it would really hurt worse than 1 out of 40! I suppose not as important in dairy herds as bull calves aren't worth much, but heifers would surely be worth the time to cull for the defect?
Valerie

[regolith]

Not unless they've found something since last time I harrassed Ambreed about what was going on with this bull. His proof still reads as it's done for years "CRV Ambreed continues to investigate the cause of a small proportion of abnormal progeny"
Probably it's time I asked them again.
I would have thought if it was a simple recessive they'd have found it by now, but who knows. Manhatten is twelve years old, after all.