Yearling bull breed??? (pic)

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Rafter E
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Yearling bull breed??? (pic)

Post by Rafter E » Fri Mar 10, 2006 9:17 am

My Father-in-law bought this bull for his heifers.
Image

I am concerned that perhaps there is less Longhorn in him that his spots would indicate.

He has no horns, thick legs and is pretty well muscled.

Please respond, I am supposed to move him and the heifers to a remote pasture where it will be tough to load him back up. If he is likely to throw big calves, and pulling 35 calves next winter is what I am facing, I would rather get rid of him and buy a better bull for calving ease.

Is he a Longhorn or not?

Thanks.


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Post by CattleAnnie » Fri Mar 10, 2006 10:18 am

Don't know much about longhorns, but would crossing a red angus with a longhorn knock the horns off the resulting calf?

If so, then maybe this is a LHxRA bull, or maybe a red poll...

Neat colouring on him though, Rafter E.



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Post by randiliana » Fri Mar 10, 2006 12:42 pm

CattleAnnie wrote:Don't know much about longhorns, but would crossing a red angus with a longhorn knock the horns off the resulting calf?

If so, then maybe this is a LHxRA bull, or maybe a red poll...

Neat colouring on him though, Rafter E.



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Crossing a LH with any polled breed would probably knock the horns off.

It is kinda hard to tell, but he looks fairly smooth. No big bulges through the shoulders and hips. There is a good possibility that he would be safe, but without more info (Birth Weight) I wouldn't guarantee anything, even with info you can be wrong sometimes. What breed/s are your heifers, a 3 way cross can cause problems too. But with longhorn in him I wouldn't get too worried, especially if you have well developed heifers.
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Post by Rustler9 » Fri Mar 10, 2006 1:09 pm

He looks alot like some of the Longhorn x Beefmaster crosses that we get. I'd say that he is either Beefmaster or Gert and Longhorn. He has some ear to him so I'd say it's one or the other. I don't think it's Charolais blood-every Longhorn x Charolais cross that I've seen has been cream colored. The Charolais usually takes the color off. He doesn't look bad, I wouldn't be concerned about big calves from him. What breed of heifers will he be put on?
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Post by Beefy » Fri Mar 10, 2006 1:22 pm

he sure looks like a beefmaster to me. a lot of times they will be painted up pretty well.


he may be half longhorn and half beefmaster. some beefmasters are polled.
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Post by okbob » Fri Mar 10, 2006 2:44 pm

looks like my beefmaster bull except polled

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Post by la4angus » Fri Mar 10, 2006 3:12 pm

Without knowing anything bout your hfrs, except that they will be first calvers and nothing about the bull except that he looks like a polled longhorn with a beautiful hide, I think you and your FIL better have a little cowbiy to cowboy conversation.
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Post by Rustler9 » Fri Mar 10, 2006 4:27 pm

Go ahead and use him on your heifers-they'll do fine.
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Post by mitchwi » Fri Mar 10, 2006 4:50 pm

Somebody with more experience than me should be stepping up here. Rafter asked "what breed" and everyone is being good boys and giving their opinion. But Rafter also voiced some concerns about this bull (YEARLING) servicing 35 heifers... now his concern is BW, but an additional concern is #of calves hitting the ground, or not.

Just because someone had to comment on experienced cattlemen being "too harsh" with the TRUTH, is everyone now going to oppress their thoughts???

HOW AM I GOING TO LEARN ANYTHING FROM THAT???

Except for la4, who is being kind with his "cowboy to cowboy talk" is hinting at some issues that should be addressed.

Or, is this my learning experience ...and this yearling bull, whatever he may be, is just dandy to go on 35 yearling heifers?

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Post by Bez! » Fri Mar 10, 2006 5:04 pm

mitchwi wrote:Somebody with more experience than me should be stepping up here. Rafter asked "what breed" and everyone is being good boys and giving their opinion. But Rafter also voiced some concerns about this bull (YEARLING) servicing 35 heifers... now his concern is BW, but an additional concern is #of calves hitting the ground, or not.

Just because someone had to comment on experienced cattlemen being "too harsh" with the TRUTH, is everyone now going to oppress their thoughts???

HOW AM I GOING TO LEARN ANYTHING FROM THAT???

Except for la4, who is being kind with his "cowboy to cowboy talk" is hinting at some issues that should be addressed.

Or, is this my learning experience ...and this yearling bull, whatever he may be, is just dandy to go on 35 yearling heifers?

Michele


Michele

I for one am afraid to comment any more. It seems no matter how I phrase them someone figures I am either rude, abrupt or rough around the edges. But ....

First off - why in the name of heavens would someone buy a bull of unknown origin - especially for heifers? Certainly not cricket, old boy. What was his actual birth date? What is his actual weight?

Use this bull - if he is a virgin you will not get good coverage initially - and may end up with a three or longer month calving program. You WILL run this guy down.

That is where I have a problem - if this is his first start - fresh out of the gate - in my opinion you need one more bull. Or split them and another bull to do about 15 or so.

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Post by Victoria » Fri Mar 10, 2006 6:57 pm

I know nothing about longhorns, you really don't see them much up here so I can't comment on that.

I just came on to post and then saw that Bez said what I was going to say. I would NEVER use a bull of unknown breeding on heifers. Where did your father-in-law get him? Can he get any more information on him? I'd at least want to know what his BW was and what his breeding is because otherwise you have no idea what you could be in for. You may be fine, but you may not. It's hard to guess by a picture. Pictures can be deceiving. Also it depends on your heifers and their size.
I also agree that 35 heifers on a year old bull is too many.

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Post by Arnold Ziffle » Fri Mar 10, 2006 7:19 pm

Rafter, assuming he has his mind & heart set on using a LH bull, maybe your father in law needs to rent a mature and proven calving ease LH bull from one of your panhandle neighbors (Running Arrow Bill). :)

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Post by Running Arrow Bill » Fri Mar 10, 2006 8:52 pm

Arnold Ziffle wrote:Rafter, assuming he has his mind & heart set on using a LH bull, maybe your father in law needs to rent a mature and proven calving ease LH bull from one of your panhandle neighbors (Running Arrow Bill). :)


Thanks for the compliment Arnold!

IMO the bull looks like he has some Longhorn in him. On the flip side, a yearling bull will have his hands full trying to breed and stay healthy with 10 - 15 heifers max. Unless one knows the exact genetics of a bull it is a crap shoot to breed one to first calf heifers--very risky--you could end up with an 80 to 120 lb calf that could end up killing the mama or both of them.

We have 4 LH bulls in service that range from 18 mos to 8 years old. Each bull has certain attributes that are paired with certain of our mature and first calf LH heifers. We would never put one of our large bulls on a first calf heifer (based on body size during breeding). All of our LH calves have ranged between about 35 and 65 lbs with the average calf weight of about 50 lbs when born. They just slip right out with no problems and hit the ground running.

In sum: Using an "unknown" bull with first calf heifers (or even others) is a Las Vegas Nite: And, the "House" usually wins...

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Post by stocky » Fri Mar 10, 2006 9:58 pm

Rafter E, I think he is a longhorn crossed with a brangus. He could possibly be longhorn/beefmaster. With longhorn/beefmaster you should be fine with the calving. If he is longhorn/brangus, I would not want the risk. The worst calving problems I have ever had with heifers were with a brangus bull. I would take him and sell him and get a 3 or 4 year old longhorn bull who can do all the work of getting the whole bunch of heifers settled and know you wont have a calving problem. You can buy they 3 or 4 year old experienced longhorn at a sale around here for 55 cents per pound and weigh from 850-950, then turn and sell him after he does the job for your money back

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Post by Caustic Burno » Sat Mar 11, 2006 2:43 pm

What you have is a train wreck looking for a spot to happen number one to many dang heifers. Rule of thumb number of heifers he can service equals months old he is.
Putting a bull you have no earthly idea what the birth weight is on first time heifers is just dumb. Go buy 2 sets of chains and a box of 22 mag's One set for pulling calves and a log chain to pull the dead or down heifers out of the field after you shoot em.
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