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Rainfall or Enhance ? President or Elation?

Posted: Wed May 22, 2019 3:07 pm
by JackAngus
Who makes a better more MARKETABLE bull Rainfall or Enhance? Going to use on heifers. Cows I can’t decide on President or Elation. I like Enhance scrotal , docility , growth. But he is weak mid rib on back. I will keep heifers.

Re: Rainfall or Enhance ? President or Elation?

Posted: Thu May 23, 2019 12:52 am
by CreekAngus
Here’s what I’ve heard from respectable folks in the industry. Rainfall makes great daughters, President better boys. Marketable is up to you, are you selling bulls to guys that raise replacements or outfits that take the steers to the rail? I wouldn’t trust the numbers on any of these bulls, not yet, their daughters aren’t milking as of yet.

Re: Rainfall or Enhance ? President or Elation?

Posted: Thu May 23, 2019 3:02 pm
by LJCB
I have 10 enhance calves and they seem to be good. My 38 specials are hands down my best calves. I'm using president some this year.

Re: Rainfall or Enhance ? President or Elation?

Posted: Thu May 23, 2019 11:56 pm
by Son of Butch
JackAngus wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 3:07 pm
Who makes a better more MARKETABLE bull Rainfall or Enhance? Going to use on heifers.
Is there even a market demand for breeding bulls from 1st calf heifers in your area?

Re: Rainfall or Enhance ? President or Elation?

Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 12:12 am
by Brookhill Angus
JackAngus wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 3:07 pm
Who makes a better more MARKETABLE bull Rainfall or Enhance? Going to use on heifers. Cows I can’t decide on President or Elation. I like Enhance scrotal , docility , growth. But he is weak mid rib on back. I will keep heifers.
I have both President AND Elation daughters. Both are excellent, both will leave lesser pedigrees behind. Of the two DNA parentage proven Elation progeny showing on Angus.org, both are mine. I can advise you from experience not speculation.

As for bulls, use President until you can get your hands on America. Don’t listen to the skeptics on President, they are going to be kicking themselves in a few years for doubting this sire. He produces sons that leave everything else looking insignificant.

Not sure about your program, but do yourself a favor, call Herbster Angus, and get President. My only regret is not using him exclusively. I’ve got some really nice Raindance daughters, but wish they were President’s instead. If that tells you anything.

Re: Rainfall or Enhance ? President or Elation?

Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 8:55 am
by LCBulls
Brookhill Angus wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 12:12 am
JackAngus wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 3:07 pm
Who makes a better more MARKETABLE bull Rainfall or Enhance? Going to use on heifers. Cows I can’t decide on President or Elation. I like Enhance scrotal , docility , growth. But he is weak mid rib on back. I will keep heifers.
I have both President AND Elation daughters. Both are excellent, both will leave lesser pedigrees behind. Of the two DNA parentage proven Elation progeny showing on Angus.org, both are mine. I can advise you from experience not speculation.

As for bulls, use President until you can get your hands on America. Don’t listen to the skeptics on President, they are going to be kicking themselves in a few years for doubting this sire. He produces sons that leave everything else looking insignificant.

Not sure about your program, but do yourself a favor, call Herbster Angus, and get President. My only regret is not using him exclusively. I’ve got some really nice Raindance daughters, but wish they were President’s instead. If that tells you anything.
I agree that the Presidents are really nice, but I’d say that I’d use Raindance if I had to choose between the two so far at our place.

Re: Rainfall or Enhance ? President or Elation?

Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 9:09 am
by W.B.
Brookhill Angus wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 12:12 am
JackAngus wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 3:07 pm
Who makes a better more MARKETABLE bull Rainfall or Enhance? Going to use on heifers. Cows I can’t decide on President or Elation. I like Enhance scrotal , docility , growth. But he is weak mid rib on back. I will keep heifers.
I have both President AND Elation daughters. Both are excellent, both will leave lesser pedigrees behind. Of the two DNA parentage proven Elation progeny showing on Angus.org, both are mine. I can advise you from experience not speculation.

As for bulls, use President until you can get your hands on America. Don’t listen to the skeptics on President, they are going to be kicking themselves in a few years for doubting this sire. He produces sons that leave everything else looking insignificant.

Not sure about your program, but do yourself a favor, call Herbster Angus, and get President. My only regret is not using him exclusively. I’ve got some really nice Raindance daughters, but wish they were President’s instead. If that tells you anything.
It is a little early in the game to make too many assumptions as to which bull will make better cows don’t you think? There are some red flags for me on President being a female maker. As far as which bull makes the most marketable sons I guess it just depends what your market is. We don’t all need and want the same things. My desire to have larger cows is quenched by the amount of forage required to maintain the larger cow. The commercial cowherd is slowly liquidating because of lack of profit. Cattle futures indicate depressed prices for a while and the 2019 corn crop is the biggest wreck in the last 30 years when you consider the demand on the crop to meet feed and ethanol needs.

Re: Rainfall or Enhance ? President or Elation?

Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 12:16 pm
by Brookhill Angus
W.B. wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 9:09 am
Brookhill Angus wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 12:12 am
JackAngus wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 3:07 pm
Who makes a better more MARKETABLE bull Rainfall or Enhance? Going to use on heifers. Cows I can’t decide on President or Elation. I like Enhance scrotal , docility , growth. But he is weak mid rib on back. I will keep heifers.
I have both President AND Elation daughters. Both are excellent, both will leave lesser pedigrees behind. Of the two DNA parentage proven Elation progeny showing on Angus.org, both are mine. I can advise you from experience not speculation.

As for bulls, use President until you can get your hands on America. Don’t listen to the skeptics on President, they are going to be kicking themselves in a few years for doubting this sire. He produces sons that leave everything else looking insignificant.

Not sure about your program, but do yourself a favor, call Herbster Angus, and get President. My only regret is not using him exclusively. I’ve got some really nice Raindance daughters, but wish they were President’s instead. If that tells you anything.
It is a little early in the game to make too many assumptions as to which bull will make better cows don’t you think? There are some red flags for me on President being a female maker. As far as which bull makes the most marketable sons I guess it just depends what your market is. We don’t all need and want the same things. My desire to have larger cows is quenched by the amount of forage required to maintain the larger cow. The commercial cowherd is slowly liquidating because of lack of profit. Cattle futures indicate depressed prices for a while and the 2019 corn crop is the biggest wreck in the last 30 years when you consider the demand on the crop to meet feed and ethanol needs.
You build when there is chaos in the market. We are not at total chaos right now, but it's probably not too far around the corner.

Once those repos set in on the equipment that cannot be paid for, there will be a lot of damage done.

There are people around here with $1 million in equipment that would happy if they make enough on beans to break even, I don't even know about corn and how it will be.

As far as the cow herd liquidating, that is a VERY GOOD thing, genetics that might be marginal will be moved on out, and better herds should be built using AI sires or high-quality sons of them.

I will probably be one of the first outside of SAV to be breeding to President daughters, and thus far they are developing above my expectations for them.

If I were going for the carcass game alone, I would be using Bubs Southern Charm, I'm hearing that he is producing some very fine steers.

I'm not suggesting that this would work for you or anyone else on CT, but watch this guy and make your own decision. He made moves to avoid being a casualty of the train wreck that's on its way for agriculture if it's not already heading off the rails as we speak.

http://bit.ly/2JBsSxT

Breeding decisions have consequences for many years out, the market can change for the better during that time. My suggestion is to breed to the best of your abilities because the cattle market ALWAYS bounces back.

Re: Rainfall or Enhance ? President or Elation?

Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 12:31 pm
by True Grit Farms
When the economy is good the cattle prices are bad.

Re: Rainfall or Enhance ? President or Elation?

Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 1:07 pm
by W.B.
Brookhill, the problem I referenced with corn is it is not getting planted. Tomorrow is the planting deadline here in SD. Suffice it to say 60% of the SD crop won’t get planted. Lots of problems other places also. This will have a major effect on feeder cattle prices. It is hard for commercial producers to build their herds when the sale of most all their heifers is necessary for cash flow. Yes I believe things will rebound but it will take awhile. Several years in fact.

Re: Rainfall or Enhance ? President or Elation?

Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 1:47 pm
by Brookhill Angus
W.B. wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 1:07 pm
Brookhill, the problem I referenced with corn is it is not getting planted. Tomorrow is the planting deadline here in SD. Suffice it to say 60% of the SD crop won’t get planted. Lots of problems other places also. This will have a major effect on feeder cattle prices. It is hard for commercial producers to build their herds when the sale of most all their heifers is necessary for cash flow. Yes I believe things will rebound but it will take awhile. Several years in fact.
I'm glad you are posting this. The major media is not covering this situation like they do juicier news. Please don't construe my comments as flippant, I feel very badly for those that are in a tough situation.

Except for the extreme azzholes that comment to the contrary, we are all in this together one way or the other. One person's pain can easily be yours the next day. I've learned that the hard way.