Fescue toxicity

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kenny thomas
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Fescue toxicity

Post by kenny thomas » Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:12 pm

Here is a link Red Bull Breeder sent me about fescue. Even though I promote it all the time I still learned something.
www.bovinevetonline.com/article/endopyt ... KYlGAuqxyg


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Re: Fescue toxicity

Post by TennesseeTuxedo » Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:15 pm

kenny thomas wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:12 pm
Here is a link Red Bull Breeder sent me about fescue. Even though I promote it all the time I still learned something.
www.bovinevetonline.com/article/endopyt ... KYlGAuqxyg
What did you learn?
Making Cattle Today Great Again!
Sometimes you do have to throw out the babies with the bath water.

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Re: Fescue toxicity

Post by kenny thomas » Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:24 pm

TennesseeTuxedo wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:15 pm
kenny thomas wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:12 pm
Here is a link Red Bull Breeder sent me about fescue. Even though I promote it all the time I still learned something.
www.bovinevetonline.com/article/endopyt ... KYlGAuqxyg
What did you learn?
I learned that the rat turd stuff I was seeing is not the toxic part. It is inside the plant and has to be identified under a microscope.
Did you learn anything?
My thoughts only, don't bet the farm on them. KT

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Re: Fescue toxicity

Post by TennesseeTuxedo » Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:26 pm

kenny thomas wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:24 pm
TennesseeTuxedo wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:15 pm
kenny thomas wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:12 pm
Here is a link Red Bull Breeder sent me about fescue. Even though I promote it all the time I still learned something.
www.bovinevetonline.com/article/endopyt ... KYlGAuqxyg
What did you learn?
I learned that the rat turd stuff I was seeing is not the toxic part. It is inside the plant and has to be identified under a microscope.
Did you learn anything?
Not yet, haven’t read it. It’ll all be news to me.
Making Cattle Today Great Again!
Sometimes you do have to throw out the babies with the bath water.

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Re: Fescue toxicity

Post by Bright Raven » Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:55 pm

I see the ergot here but not nearly so abundant as I have seen it on the fescue heads at Fire Sweep Ranch in Missouri.
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Re: Fescue toxicity

Post by kenny thomas » Sun Jul 07, 2019 10:05 pm

Bright Raven wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:55 pm
I see the ergot here but not nearly so abundant as I have seen it on the fescue heads at Fire Sweep Ranch in Missouri.
I see it here also but according to the article that's not what caused the problem.
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Re: Fescue toxicity

Post by Fire Sweep Ranch » Sun Jul 07, 2019 10:57 pm

kenny thomas wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:24 pm
TennesseeTuxedo wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:15 pm
kenny thomas wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:12 pm
Here is a link Red Bull Breeder sent me about fescue. Even though I promote it all the time I still learned something.
www.bovinevetonline.com/article/endopyt ... KYlGAuqxyg
What did you learn?
I learned that the rat turd stuff I was seeing is not the toxic part. It is inside the plant and has to be identified under a microscope.
Did you learn anything?
You did not read it clearly. The ergot, which is the rat turds, does the same thing as the ergovalene in the leaf (which we can not see) Quoted from the article":
"Both are associated with fescue and both produce ergot alkaloids which cause vasoconstriction or reduced blood flow throughout the animal's body.

"The difference is, ergot is highly visible in the seedhead while the endophyte fungus is only visible after staining and looking for it under a microscope. It is called an endophyte because it grows inside the plant."

Eldon Cole, who wrote the article, is our extension specialist for beef cattle. There was a recent newsletter that went out about concerns for our hay put up this year. It is mostly late, and contains the seeds that look like rat turds, in ABUNDANT amounts. This will cause more problems with fescue sensitive animals this winter when fed.
https://hayandforage.com/article-1276-k ... ntrol.html

Quoted from this article: "Most tall fescue in the central portion of the eastern U.S. is infected by the fungal endophyte, and the seedhead is one of the best sources of the toxins produced. Mature seedheads of any grass are also a possible source of toxin from ergot, which is a fungus that can infect the seedhead, being even more toxic than the fescue endophyte. "

I think Eldon was mearly pointing out that we can SEE the toxin in the seedheads, we CAN NOT see the toxin in the grass.
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Re: Fescue toxicity

Post by TennesseeTuxedo » Mon Jul 08, 2019 4:57 am

So then clipping seed heads off when possible won’t prevent fescue toxicity problems like we’ve always thought if it’s also in the grass itself, correct?
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Re: Fescue toxicity

Post by Ebenezer » Mon Jul 08, 2019 6:11 am

Between cell walls. Hay storage helps diminish the concentration. Ergot is a whole different issue but still bothers livestock.

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Re: Fescue toxicity

Post by Fire Sweep Ranch » Mon Jul 08, 2019 12:53 pm

TennesseeTuxedo wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 4:57 am
So then clipping seed heads off when possible won’t prevent fescue toxicity problems like we’ve always thought if it’s also in the grass itself, correct?
Correct. But clipping the seed heads off will lower the toxicity. So still clip when you can. Like I said, there is a huge concern for MO hay put up this year. With all the rain, no one could get it cut prior to it getting too mature, so most hay will be loaded with toxic seed heads. Extension specialists are warning to watch for symptoms this winter of toxicity while feeding hay.
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