No till pastures

Discuss grasses and how to grow and harvest them.
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No till pastures

Post by ValleyView » Wed May 01, 2019 11:19 pm

Anyone here have much experience no till drilling pastures for grazing and/or hay production?

Recently no tilled 25 acres with a rented 6’ drill from local NRCS office and just waiting patiently for it all pop up.


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Re: No till pastures

Post by Red Bull Breeder » Thu May 02, 2019 7:26 am

That's a long day with a 6 foot drill. I drill a few hundred acres of hay ground a year adding ochard grass and clover. Its easy to get the seed to deep.

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Re: No till pastures

Post by Texasmark » Thu May 02, 2019 7:37 am

I thought about feasibility when I first heard the term. Didn't know you needed a special drill to do it. Being a STO that stopped me in my tracks. I have a regular double coulter 1960 vintage JD drill for regular planting but to no till either in hard clay or mud (my extremes) I'd have to catch the soil just right to be able to do any good with my drill.

I did broadcast KY31 mixed in with fertilizer a couple of years ago on the waning Coastal patch and came back with a spike/chain harrow over it. Today KY and volunteer Rye are thick, over 2' high, seeded out, some of it laying over with all the rain, hope it doesn't mildew, and I'll cut it as soon as it dries out. Really impressed how well KY caught on and the seeds it produces for next year and beyond self preservation......do hope it dries out soon. If it doesn't it's all going back in the ground....wow what a mess that will be......buttt down the road....

Got the long term forecast for this summer from somewhere (forget) and my area is to stay wet this summer. Ok fine, just let me get some hay up between showers....will take the rain gladly, but under my terms. Grin!

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Re: No till pastures

Post by farmguy » Thu May 02, 2019 8:01 am

I live in Minnesota so this may not apply. I have rotational pastures that are 20 years old. They were initially planted to alfalfa and brome. Of course quack grass came in. Some places the legumes were scarce so first I tried frost seeding with very little success. Now I seed a mixture of red clover and alfalfa with my no till drill. I have the best luck grazing the strips short in fall and going in with the drill after danger of cold weather is past and existing vegetation has not started to grow yet. This is about the last half or third of April. The resulting seeds don't show up much until the following year. I plant clover and alfalfa because if the alfalfa is scarce the autotoxicity will not interfere with the new alfalfa. The red clover can grow if the alfalfa is inhibited. This seems to work for me so I can improve the strips but still use them. farmguy

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Re: No till pastures

Post by Bigfoot » Thu May 02, 2019 8:15 am

Texasmark wrote:
Thu May 02, 2019 7:37 am
I thought about feasibility when I first heard the term. Didn't know you needed a special drill to do it. Being a STO that stopped me in my tracks. I have a regular double coulter 1960 vintage JD drill for regular planting but to no till either in hard clay or mud (my extremes) I'd have to catch the soil just right to be able to do any good with my drill.

I did broadcast KY31 mixed in with fertilizer a couple of years ago on the waning Coastal patch and came back with a spike/chain harrow over it. Today KY and volunteer Rye are thick, over 2' high, seeded out, some of it laying over with all the rain, hope it doesn't mildew, and I'll cut it as soon as it dries out. Really impressed how well KY caught on and the seeds it produces for next year and beyond self preservation......do hope it dries out soon. If it doesn't it's all going back in the ground....wow what a mess that will be......buttt down the road....

Got the long term forecast for this summer from somewhere (forget) and my area is to stay wet this summer. Ok fine, just let me get some hay up between showers....will take the rain gladly, but under my terms. Grin!
I have seen you post a few different times about growing fescue. Are many in your area growing it? I can raise it here quit prolifically, I would also like to have some warm seasons, and stay off of my fescue during the slump. Keep it for stockpiling.
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Re: No till pastures

Post by Stocker Steve » Thu May 02, 2019 11:04 am

Yes.
Not my favorite. Our NRCS Haybuster requires advance reservation, does not close the seed trench if conditions are not right, and seedlings to not compete well with established sod.
I get better results and don't have to pay $15/acre rent by going out with my old grain press drill when conditions are right.
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Re: No till pastures

Post by hurleyjd » Thu May 02, 2019 11:33 am

Texasmark wrote:
Thu May 02, 2019 7:37 am
I thought about feasibility when I first heard the term. Didn't know you needed a special drill to do it. Being a STO that stopped me in my tracks. I have a regular double coulter 1960 vintage JD drill for regular planting but to no till either in hard clay or mud (my extremes) I'd have to catch the soil just right to be able to do any good with my drill.

I did broadcast KY31 mixed in with fertilizer a couple of years ago on the waning Coastal patch and came back with a spike/chain harrow over it. Today KY and volunteer Rye are thick, over 2' high, seeded out, some of it laying over with all the rain, hope it doesn't mildew, and I'll cut it as soon as it dries out. Really impressed how well KY caught on and the seeds it produces for next year and beyond self preservation......do hope it dries out soon. If it doesn't it's all going back in the ground....wow what a mess that will be......buttt down the road....

Got the long term forecast for this summer from somewhere (forget) and my area is to stay wet this summer. Ok fine, just let me get some hay up between showers....will take the rain gladly, but under my terms. Grin!
What time of year did you seed fescue. I am in east Texas and do not see any one using fescue.

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Re: No till pastures

Post by Banjo » Thu May 02, 2019 12:42 pm

ValleyView wrote:
Wed May 01, 2019 11:19 pm
Anyone here have much experience no till drilling pastures for grazing and/or hay production?

Recently no tilled 25 acres with a rented 6’ drill from local NRCS office and just waiting patiently for it all pop up.
What did you plant? I thought about doing that this year for some summer annuals or maybe late summer /early fall.
Did some sorghum sudan a couple of years ago and it did good. i have been watching a few videos from Gabe Brown and Ray Archuleta . It seems to be the prevailing thought that you need to plant a mixed species not just one thing like SS in effect...monoculture.

That's my opinion.....feel free to make it yours.

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Re: No till pastures

Post by ValleyView » Thu May 02, 2019 11:28 pm

Banjo,
I actually jumped on the Green Cover Seed bandwagon and planted three different mixes in three pastures. Peas, Oats and Hairy Vetch in my exclusive hay pasture, SS and Milo in a mixed use pasture and Subflowers, Millet, SS, peas, oats, Korean lespedeza, mung beans, buckwheat and few others in my grazing pasture. Got a hot fence up in my grazing pasture for another 50 days or so before I start rotating the cows in to graze. I can send my specific mixes in an email if you’d like.

Our place was leased and grazed to the ground for decades prior to buying it so I spent most of last year eradicating Sericea. Mostly fescue and native grasses came back this spring thus far.

And yes, it was a marathon planting job 6’ at a pass on my no cab Massey 240. I wanted to quit multiple times! But hey, if it were easy everyone would do it!

Lastly, can’t say enough about the folks at Green Cover Seed! They were great helped me tremendously through this process!
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Re: No till pastures

Post by Banjo » Fri May 03, 2019 6:11 am

ValleyView wrote:
Thu May 02, 2019 11:28 pm
Banjo,
I actually jumped on the Green Cover Seed bandwagon and planted three different mixes in three pastures. Peas, Oats and Hairy Vetch in my exclusive hay pasture, SS and Milo in a mixed use pasture and Subflowers, Millet, SS, peas, oats, Korean lespedeza, mung beans, buckwheat and few others in my grazing pasture. Got a hot fence up in my grazing pasture for another 50 days or so before I start rotating the cows in to graze. I can send my specific mixes in an email if you’d like.

Our place was leased and grazed to the ground for decades prior to buying it so I spent most of last year eradicating Sericea. Mostly fescue and native grasses came back this spring thus far.

And yes, it was a marathon planting job 6’ at a pass on my no cab Massey 240. I wanted to quit multiple times! But hey, if it were easy everyone would do it!

Lastly, can’t say enough about the folks at Green Cover Seed! They were great helped me tremendously through this process!
Yes i know about greencoverseed.com and their smartmix app. I've been playing around with it.
What part of the country are you located?

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Re: No till pastures

Post by cowrancher75 » Fri May 03, 2019 6:36 am

i've interplanted a lot of different plants in existing pastures.

sudan comes in great.. crimson clover comes in great. grasses come in decent.. rye / triticale comes in great.

vetch is hard.

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Re: No till pastures

Post by Texasmark » Fri May 03, 2019 6:42 am

hurleyjd wrote:
Thu May 02, 2019 11:33 am
Texasmark wrote:
Thu May 02, 2019 7:37 am
I thought about feasibility when I first heard the term. Didn't know you needed a special drill to do it. Being a STO that stopped me in my tracks. I have a regular double coulter 1960 vintage JD drill for regular planting but to no till either in hard clay or mud (my extremes) I'd have to catch the soil just right to be able to do any good with my drill.

I did broadcast KY31 mixed in with fertilizer a couple of years ago on the waning Coastal patch and came back with a spike/chain harrow over it. Today KY and volunteer Rye are thick, over 2' high, seeded out, some of it laying over with all the rain, hope it doesn't mildew, and I'll cut it as soon as it dries out. Really impressed how well KY caught on and the seeds it produces for next year and beyond self preservation......do hope it dries out soon. If it doesn't it's all going back in the ground....wow what a mess that will be......buttt down the road....

Got the long term forecast for this summer from somewhere (forget) and my area is to stay wet this summer. Ok fine, just let me get some hay up between showers....will take the rain gladly, but under my terms. Grin!
What time of year did you seed fescue. I am in east Texas and do not see any one using fescue.
September/October timeline when fall rains started, 15-5-10 fertilizer at 2 bags/acre (100#).

Some background---kinda long but if an interested party: Actually I planted some Tall Fescue many years ago (don't think it was KY 31...didn't know to pay attention) on my pond dam when I built it back in the late '80s because in reading up in the sales brochure, it seemed to be what would work for me with my weather. Over the years it has only been dormant in the July-August time line. I never considered it for pasture because I thought of it as more of a turf grass for lawns.....but......

Fast Forward: So I'm trying to get something to grow that can tolerate the funny weather here in N. Texas and give me a marketable crop since my Coastal patch is waning and my old standby Sorghum Sudan is now limited to 1st of July and it has to come off....Sugar Cane Aphids, since summer of 2014. They just make a gooey mess out of the crop and I am not going to spray poison on the hay I am going to sell to folks to feed to their animals....herbicides like 2-4D for weed control prior to the plant growth, but nothing on it...just how I feel about it. So I was spraying Fire Ants one day and the thought hit me....why not?

Other thing is with the high cost of fertilizer and the winter rains erosion, I had been wanting a winter cover crop for several years. As mentioned elsewhere, I started planting Austrian Field (Winter) Peas and really, really like the results and with my summer crop all but in shambles I have moved into (risky....due to wet spring weather) winter crops.

This year I have a bumper crop of Peas/Jumbo Rye in one field and Ky-31 and volunteer clover in the other, both fields at-over 2' and thick. Both fields are reseeding themselves (peas have bloomed, will see about any seed pods) due to the wet weather. But the wet weather is good and it gives me an excuse to let the crops mature, reseeding themselves, and with the type of crop with legumes, I'm not worried about the quality of product for non-picky equine and bovine/goat customers. Looks like a summer crop will not be in the makings this year. Now all I have to do is to get the right weather for baling!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Re: No till pastures

Post by ValleyView » Fri May 03, 2019 7:04 am

cowrancher75 wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 6:36 am
i've interplanted a lot of different plants in existing pastures.

sudan comes in great.. crimson clover comes in great. grasses come in decent.. rye / triticale comes in great.

vetch is hard.
Good to know. Just curious are these results from broadcast or no till? I’m considering triticale and rye in my cool season mix for the winter.
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Re: No till pastures

Post by ValleyView » Fri May 03, 2019 7:11 am

Banjo wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 6:11 am
ValleyView wrote:
Thu May 02, 2019 11:28 pm
Banjo,
I actually jumped on the Green Cover Seed bandwagon and planted three different mixes in three pastures. Peas, Oats and Hairy Vetch in my exclusive hay pasture, SS and Milo in a mixed use pasture and Subflowers, Millet, SS, peas, oats, Korean lespedeza, mung beans, buckwheat and few others in my grazing pasture. Got a hot fence up in my grazing pasture for another 50 days or so before I start rotating the cows in to graze. I can send my specific mixes in an email if you’d like.

Our place was leased and grazed to the ground for decades prior to buying it so I spent most of last year eradicating Sericea. Mostly fescue and native grasses came back this spring thus far.

And yes, it was a marathon planting job 6’ at a pass on my no cab Massey 240. I wanted to quit multiple times! But hey, if it were easy everyone would do it!

Lastly, can’t say enough about the folks at Green Cover Seed! They were great helped me tremendously through this process!
Yes i know about greencoverseed.com and their smartmix app. I've been playing around with it.
What part of the country are you located?
The smartmix app taught me quite a bit and was very useful. I’m located in NE Oklahoma.

If this crop/forage comes up well, I will most likely follow up with a fall application as well.

One thing I forgot to mention, I had very low P and K with Ph ranging from 5.5-6.8 in my pastures and put down 150lbs p/a of 9-23-30 and 50lbs of AMS a week before planting. It’s been an expensive spring!!
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Re: No till pastures

Post by snoopdog » Fri May 03, 2019 5:46 pm

ValleyView wrote:
Thu May 02, 2019 11:28 pm
Banjo,
I actually jumped on the Green Cover Seed bandwagon and planted three different mixes in three pastures. Peas, Oats and Hairy Vetch in my exclusive hay pasture, SS and Milo in a mixed use pasture and Subflowers, Millet, SS, peas, oats, Korean lespedeza, mung beans, buckwheat and few others in my grazing pasture. Got a hot fence up in my grazing pasture for another 50 days or so before I start rotating the cows in to graze. I can send my specific mixes in an email if you’d like.

Our place was leased and grazed to the ground for decades prior to buying it so I spent most of last year eradicating Sericea. Mostly fescue and native grasses came back this spring thus far.

And yes, it was a marathon planting job 6’ at a pass on my no cab Massey 240. I wanted to quit multiple times! But hey, if it were easy everyone would do it!

Lastly, can’t say enough about the folks at Green Cover Seed! They were great helped me tremendously through this process!
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